Is there a Long Range Locator capable of this?

Sadly, this is hypothetical...

I know 3 chests of gold are buried - somewhere within 300 acres...  at 8 feet deep.  There is no (or very little) iron buried with the cache.

How do I locate them?

This is the official re-opening of the TreasureNet Long Range Locator Forum.


PLEASE NOTE: As the administrator, creator and owner of this site, I HAVE SEEN PEOPLE GET RIPPED OFF (defrauded) by people selling so-called "long range locators" (devices, that supposedly, can find precious metals at a distance).  I HIGHLY recommend consulting a geophysicist ($100 in consulting fees could save you thousands, and you'll learn something!), before spending ONE DIME ON ANY "long range locator" .  With that, I open this forum to the discussion of said devices.  

Well according to cassbiz, it looks like the bionic 01 is capable of it, since he uses one. Of course he is a factory rep so.......
Here's the "device" - http://www.okmmetaldetectors.com/products/longrange/bionic01.php

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,280422.0.html

     I don't know if this works on land but it might be worth talking to these guys. Good luck,

Charlie

LRL? No, of course not.

Chests made of what? How big? Roughly how much gold each? Buried how long ago? Acreage is field, woods, level, rocky...?

I'm sure there is something.  I mean, if it's a chest of highly conductive metal, surrounded by dirt, heck yeah.  If there isn't there should be... and it wouldn't be hard to design.

I believe Kreskin is doing side jobs now.

I'm glad to see this discussion. I don't know if there are any LRL'S that work (I've never tried one), but I still think they could be made.

I have one and it works great.....I don't sell 'em just use one that is beyond belief! The guy that invented it is a genius, he use to help rockets get where they need to go, and is a great guy too.

If you have something you would like to find and have done all the research I am willing to travel....for a percentage of course. If you just have a legend and want me to check it out its the same deal only I'll need my expenses taken care of. We put it all in writting first, and yes I will sign a nondisclosure statement. I live near the Cincinnati area. 

You all have read about the guy (from Hollywood) who thinks he has a shipwreck found but everything is tied up in court? Well if he had known about my device and got hold of me he could have found out for sure before bothering people and getting run off the property!

Oh yea, for those negative guys out there...before you even start let me say I'll put up.......but it will cost you! ha ha

LRL? No, of course not.

Chests made of what? How big? Roughly how much gold each? Buried how long ago? Acreage is field, woods, level, rocky...?

The owner / administrator asked how he would locate these treasure chests with an LRL, i.e. is it capable (subject to the caveats that he outlined in red).

Why would you jump on your own bandwagon and ask irrelevant questions to the OP? Everyone knows your position. But the question, posted by an obviously extremely intelligent sceptic, didn't ask "Can anyone help me find some treasure?" Its an open question to LRL users, not raging demonisers. Why not just let the thread flow and see what happens? Or are you going to censor Mark too?

The owner / administrator asked how he would locate these treasure chests with an LRL, i.e. is it capable (subject to the caveats that he outlined in red).

Why would you jump on your own bandwagon and ask irrelevant questions to the OP? Everyone knows your position. But the question, posted by an obviously extremely intelligent sceptic, didn't ask "Can anyone help me find some treasure?" Its an open question to LRL users, not raging demonisers. Why not just let the thread flow and see what happens? Or are you going to censor Mark too?

The title Marc chose for the thread was, "Is there a Long Range Locator capable of this?"

My response to this questions was, "LRL? No, of course not." My response is based on my experience that LRLs simply don't work.

His post then asked, "How do I locate them?" Which sounds a whole lot like, "Can anyone help me find some treasure?"

Since the right approach depends very heavily on the exact situation, I asked some questions to help guide my (and others') recommendations. If you believe this to be a wrong approach, then by all means, let's hear your suggestions!

- Carl

Notice that I am not asking those questions because it doesn't matter when you have the right device.

Those are questions regular Metal detectors and GPR have to have answered....not needed for a real LRL. If the moderator actually has this treasure narrowed down (and the treasure is not a philosophical one) he needs to PM me.  It can be in plastic, glass, etc. doesn’t matter. The only negative is I cannot find paper money (at this time). But it’s a killer on gold and silver!

The title Marc chose for the thread was, "Is there a Long Range Locator capable of this?"

His post then asked, "How do I locate them?" Which sounds a whole lot like, "Can anyone help me find some treasure?"

But in the context of using an LRL. Perhaps it was an invite, perhaps an enquiring sceptical challenge. All good. But its in an LRL thread. That's not rocket science to figure that he intended (here anyway) "Can anyone WITH AN LRL help me find some treasure?" For a poster noted for painstaking detail, why miss the wood for the trees? Never let emotion get in the way of an enquiring mind.

Since the right approach depends very heavily on the exact situation, I asked some questions to help guide my (and others') recommendations. If you believe this to be a wrong approach, then by all means, let's hear your suggestions!

Your questions are good for expanding the subject, but this is all about using an LRL to find these.

Looks like there is interest from Curtis already. Let's just see how it goes? Just for once?

I'm delighted to see this thread and renewed section to the forum. I'm an adult, triple degreed and don't need anyone holding my hand online. Way to go Tnet.

Lets see..We have gold buried 8 feet deep somewhere on  300 acres.  That is a little smaller than a full section of land. I would ask the map dowsers on t/net to dowse it for me. That should cut the search area down to less than 50 acres. Most LRL’s with an operator who has took the time to learn his machine should be able to find the treasure in a couple of hours. Yes…Some LRL’s can find the Treasure…Art

Lets see..We have gold buried 8 feet deep somewhere on  300 acres.  That is a little smaller than a full section of land. I would ask the map dowsers on t/net to dowse it for me. That should cut the search area down to less than 50 acres. Most LRL’s with an operator who has took the time to learn his machine should be able to find the treasure in a couple of hours. Yes…Some LRL’s can find the Treasure…Art

Hi Art, and I would add this interesting test by David Villanueva to Marc's research http://www.truetreasure.info/freelrlreport.pdf Yes Marc, I think there are people on here that could help you locate that treasure.

does anyone have instructions on a f400 system that Ralph Schull put out a few years ago? using two modified metel detectors to trace a signal line to a target i have this set up but instructions are not very good.  Thanks Bildon

well. all i know is. if you cant spell artifacts, the thingamajig you made to find them probably doesnt work

Hey PAPPYGOL….i can locate. Copper, Brass, Bronze, most kinds of gemstones, Dinosaur Bones, porcelain, pottery and most anything else you can think of….If you know what its made of it can be located…Every thing on this earth both living and dead has  it’s on Frequency. If you know the frequency  you can locate it…Art

Actually, you don't even have to have a Frequency generator, or know the frequency any more to discriminate to the items you mention.  I've revived an old discovery that seems to discriminate, and generate signal lines to just about anything that is placed in the sample chamber.  And it's inexpensive.   Dell

LINK:  http://dowse.webs.com/apps/webstore/products/show/302027

does anyone have instructions on a f400 system that Ralph Schull put out a few years ago? using two modified metel detectors to trace a signal line to a target i have this set up but instructions are not very good.  Thanks Bildon

The strength of the magnetic field surrounding the earth is essential, and key to the operation of ALL LRL , MFD, and Directional locators. A weak surrounding "Strength of field" (SOF) means a strong, detectable target, and signal line, and optimum operating conditions. A strong SOF above ground overrides the  "field" of the Signal line, or target, making it weak, or non detectable.

Electronic receivers are less sensitive than the Rod(s) and are subject to longer, and more frequent blocking  of reception, than the Rod(s)  The most frequent  type of interference is caused by the residual effect of years of Solar activity bombarding the Earth with charged particles (magnetic) which now scatter, or concentrate at the whims of the wind & weather. At any given time you may encounter bad, or no reception ( a weak, or non existing Signal line, or target "Field") where you are at. But, reception may be good just a few miles from you. Or the SOF may fluxiate in and out, from one second to the next making it impossible to conduct an accurate survey.

To give you an example, a friend from PA, went to NJ, 150 miles away, where he tested the Shull detector with excellent results. He took the detector back to PA, and it didn't work. Shull, sent him another detector and it didn't work either. My friend took the detector back to Shull, in NJ, and it worked perfectly. He stayed in NJ for a week finding Silver coins & Gold plated jewelry under the boardwalk. He returned to PA, and the Shull detector again would not work. He brought it to Florida, where we only had an operable SOF for the Shull detector, twice in an entire week.

Unfortunately, with an electronic receiver you have no way of knowing if you have sufficient SOF for your LRL to work, or if it is not tuned properly.  You may want to learn to use the Rods to meter the signal by using a test object, and angling the tips of the Rod(s) towards the ground, you can determine if you have enough  signal SOF for the detector to work.   Dell

if i saw it with my own eyes. i would believe it. to believe someone can accuratley locate something buried 6 or 8 feet down in the ground from hundreds of yards away. is science fiction to me. also, if there was a machine able to do this, , and this i know this is true, whites, or garrett or fisher  would have one on the market today. as we all know. charles garrett is an einstein in his own time.

if i saw it with my own eyes. i would believe it. to believe someone can accuratley locate something buried 6 or 8 feet down in the ground from hundreds of yards away. is science fiction to me. also, if there was a machine able to do this, , and this i know this is true, whites, or garrett or fisher  would have one on the market today. as we all know. charles garrett is an einstein in his own time.

Let me repeat this again. LRL, MFD, Directional locators, or L-Rods, DO NOT detect targets below, or above the ground, period

They will detect an emanating "FIELD" of a target "IF" it rises above the surface of the ground, and has a sufficient "strength of Field", to be detectable.

Yes, I know Charlie Garrett, and Kenny White, personally. Garrett, has detectors he has built for his personal use that are superior to the ones he has on the market. Some detectors used by Professional Treasure Hunters, or manufacturers  aren't marketed  because they have to comply with FCC regulations to be on the market

Kenny White, is opposed to LRL in it's present state of development and anything that suggests  even a hint of Dowsing. That doesn't stop my great respect and admiration for him, or us from being friends. I am very grateful for the encouragement, help and friendship he has given me.  He is one of my greatest treasures in life.

You should understand also that LRL, etc, is intended to aid in the search for deep buried targets that are beyond the depth range of conventional detectors.  Hobbyist are not interested in carrying a shovel & pick with them to dig 10-20 foot holes every time they get a beep. It's the lucrative hobbyist industry that Garrett, Whites, Fisher, and other Detector companies  cater to. So, put your self in their shoes, why would they waste money for R&D, only to serve a tiny niche market, when they already have an established lucrative market ?     Dell

I am happy to see that Marc decided to open discussion again on this forum about Long Range locator's. What is a treasurenet forum with out LRL discussion. There are LRL equipment on the market that works when you take the time to learn how to use them. It takes more then one piece of LRL equipment to locate and retrieve a gold or silver cache. Thank You.
Bullet:Mich.

PLEASE NOTE: As the administrator, creator and owner of this site, I HAVE SEEN PEOPLE GET RIPPED OFF (defrauded) by people selling so-called "long range locators" (devices, that supposedly, can find precious metals at a distance). I HIGHLY recommend consulting a geophysicist ($100 in consulting fees could save you thousands, and you'll learn something!), before spending ONE DIME ON ANY "long range locator" . With that, I open this forum to the discussion of said devices.

Marc, common sense will tell you that LRL's do not find Gold, precious metals, or anything else. They are merely a tool that serve as an aid in our search. LRL's and MFD have no intelligence of their own to find Treasure for any one, so why would you, or anyone, logically expect such a performance from a dumb, stupid, piece of equipment which has no intelligence of it's own

They all require the intelligence, knowledge, and experience of a human operator. Any LRL, regardless of manufacture, or advertising hype,  will only be as good as the knowledge and experience of the person using them.

The concept falsely promoted by the Skeptic agenda is according to their interpretation of some manufacturers advertising is that LRL technology is supposed to mark an exact spot on the ground, and all the operator has to do is dig there, and go home rich. Well, everyone knows that isn't going to happen every time you use an LRL, or any other tool. So the Skeptic mentality makes the play that because it doesn't happen consistently every time, and it's not scientifically endorsed, it doesn't happen at all, and it's been my experience that if LRL use is successful, the critic's will deny the facts and claim it was merely random chance, without investigating the truth.

My philosphy is, "what has already been done, can be done". Treasure has been found with LRL, so it's already been proven it can be done.  April 18, 2002, a major Spanish Gold find, and recovery was  made with an LRL, with a link to photos, was posted on your own forum, which you and the skeptics refused to acknowledge, and you deleted the post from TNET, without apology.

I don't post reported LRL finds on TNET, because you have threatened to ban me permanently if I do. Has that changed? If so, I need it in writing, and my -------- e-mail address removed from your profanity filter. Other wise, your LRL forum will just be a TNET sponsored media for Carl, Randi, Sam, and radical members of the Skeptic Organization, to freely serve their agenda against LRL sellers, and users, and proponents as they were  permitted to do in the previous LRL forum.

I have been with you since the beginning of TNET, probably longer than anyone, and although my memory isn't as good, I recall what was  probably your most popular, and successful TNET  forum of the time was called "Molecular Frequency Discrimination" (MFD)  The origin of that title was --------, a name you have since banned from being used on TNET. This was long before "Electroscope" came on the market as the first to use the term "Long Range Locator" which was in reference only to their products at the time.

Yes, because it has already been done by others in the past, has been proven, the precedent has been set, so,  it may be possible to locate the Treasure you seek with the use of Map Dowsing, and an experienced LRL operator. Every situation is different, so their is no way of knowing for sure, until you  excavate, make a recovery, and hold the proof in your hand. There is rarely any instant results to finding major Treasure Troves, and certainly no predictions can be made. It takes hard work, time, and money. You use all the tools you can afford to have available to you, and hope for the best. There are never any guarantees of success.

Remote Sensing  Discrimination LRL,  is one of the fastest, and best,  tools I have ever used for preliminary investigations of a potential Treasure site to help me decide whether to dig, or not dig, and determine if the cost of a possible recovery is feasible.

Mel Fisher, asked me once, that if he buried 15 lbs of Gold behind his museum, could I find it with my MFD? I replied Yes, give me one week. Of course, that wasn't satisfactory because he wanted instantaneous results for the media to witness. That's not treasure Hunting reality. Over expectations, and dreams of getting rich, are common for folks wanting to get into Treasure hunting. There are Vendors of every type of product, anxiously awaiting to take advantage of those who attempt to leap into buying Treasure hunting equipment without first investigating. I am not one of those vendors, and never have been.  

I don't understand your reasoning for starting an LRL forum again, but if your intention is for the forum to serve as a media for LRL users to share information, facts,  finds, and Ideas, with those who wish to learn, and you are willing to enforce the integrity of such discussions, I certainly welcome, and will support that format.

For me, well informed consumers make the very best customers, and long time friends.  I hope this forum works out.  Good Luck!     Dell

Marc, common sense will tell you that LRL's do not find Gold, precious metals, or anything else. They are merely a tool that serve as an aid in our search. LRL's and MFD have no intelligence of their own to find Treasure for any one, so why would you, or anyone, logically expect such a performance from a dumb, stupid, piece of equipment which has no intelligence of it's own 

They all require the intelligence, knowledge, and experience of a human operator. Any LRL, regardless of manufacture, or advertising hype,  will only be as good as the knowledge and experience of the person using them.

Very good Dell…..Hours of practice….Learning if the signal is real or is going to a ring or a ray…It is not a buy and get rich instrument…..Art

yep there it is the f400 system in the picture sure wished i knew the owner would like some instructions   bildon

Bildon, the photo was taken during tests conducted in my yard. I'll E-mail you the name and phone number I have for the owner.  Dell

Thanks Dell you are one of the few fine people out there and i enjoy your articles very much please keep on writing about these articles and i will watch for the email Thanks Bildon

Hey Dell, I have to say that you make a very good point that really refers to any and all pieces of equipment regardless of their nature or functionality.

An equipment operator only becomes more proficient with practice and experience.  Though a person knows how to drive a car, doesn't mean they can drive a race car at full speed through a corner without the necessary practice and experience.

There are so many out there with ultra biased opinions that without the operational knowledge of any equipment, how can any statements be regarded as true or false, they are just mere opinions.  I have seen some LRL's work and others not.  Without the proper testing, learning and practicing, how can anyone make truly factual statements.

Frank

Hey Dell, I have to say that you make a very good point that really refers to any and all pieces of equipment regardless of their nature or functionality.

An equipment operator only becomes more proficient with practice and experience.  Though a person knows how to drive a car, doesn't mean they can drive a race car at full speed through a corner without the necessary practice and experience.

There are so many out there with ultra biased opinions that without the operational knowledge of any equipment, how can any statements be regarded as true or false, they are just mere opinions.  I have seen some LRL's work and others not.  Without the proper testing, learning and practicing, how can anyone make truly factual statements.

Frank

Alternatively, Frank...one can also say there are so many deceptive claims and advertisements from LRL manufactures/salesmen that it would not be a wise choice to purchase such a device without the benefit of legitimate lab reports. Even your statement "I have seen some LRL's work and other not" leads to skepticism and doubt that any of them work. Who would want to take a chance on buying the "others not"

SWR,

Honestly I haven't been around enough of them to say Yeah or Nay.  I just received one from the factory to test and I can say that personally at this point I am impressed.  As soon as I find something of value then at that point I will be really impressed. 

In a post from another user, finding treasure is not looking for a needle in a haystack, it is looking for a particular needle in a needle stack. 

I have found that no one piece of equipment is perfect for every application.  I use several, for the more instruments that give me a positive reading, the more likely I am to go and chase it.

Frank

[Honestly I haven't been around enough of them to say Yeah or Nay.]

SWR,

Honestly I haven't been around enough of them to say Yeah or Nay.  I just received one from the factory to test and I can say that personally at this point I am impressed.  As soon as I find something of value then at that point I will be really impressed. 

In a post from another user, finding treasure is not looking for a needle in a haystack, it is looking for a particular needle in a needle stack. 

I have found that no one piece of equipment is perfect for every application.  I use several, for the more instruments that give me a positive reading, the more likely I am to go and chase it.

Frank

Thanks for your reply, Frank.  Looking forward to your opinion on that new rig ya got   

There are so many out there with ultra biased opinions that without the operational knowledge of any equipment, how can any statements be regarded as true or false, they are just mere opinions.  I have seen some LRL's work and others not.  Without the proper testing, learning and practicing, how can anyone make truly factual statements.

I have found that no one piece of equipment is perfect for every application.  I use several, for the more instruments that give me a positive reading, the more likely I am to go and chase it.

Right on Frank….When I go out I always have a backup with me….It may be a walkie-talkie, cell phone, a calculator and a set of baited Dowsing rods…They all can be used in case you need them…Art

I was reading about the cell phone and the number 512   What is that about?

I have found that no one piece of equipment is perfect for every application.  I use several, for the more instruments that give me a positive reading, the more likely I am to go and chase it.

Right on Frank….When I go out I always have a backup with me….It may be a walkie-talkie, cell phone, a calculator and a set of baited Dowsing rods…They all can be used in case you need them…Art

Soooo, Art. You think the walkie-talkie, cell phone and calculator can transmit the same "frequency" as gold?  Interesting.

How many watts ya think it takes to shake that gold around enough for the dowsing wands to "lock on" to it?


 

I was reading about the cell phone and the number  512    What is that about?

Hey cassbiz……Numbers 511to 514 came from Ranger Tell a lot of years ago. That’s just what they are..numbers.
One morning I was charging my wife’s cell phone and also doing some testing on calculators..When the phone was charged I put the numbers into it and the rods closed between it and the gold….A few days later I was at a Thanksgiving dinner and checked 5 more cell phones..

I then went out to the hills and set the cell phone on the ground, Took a !/4 oz nugget and walked up the road. I would set the nugget down and check the signal line….When the signal became weak I marked the spot and went back to the car…It was close to a ¼ mile to the place I had marked….

I have also tested it buried at 1 foot and 3 feet…Works darn good….Some one can see if they can use a LRL with this thing…The 512 number is not very good as it picks up the rings…Art

Ranger Tell :  Shouldn't be dating yourself.   

Like I said, don't know too much the LRL's but am open to all technologies. 

I have even listened to map dowsers, some can, some can't.  With that being said, anyplace is a good place to start.

Just an old man trying to pass my knowledge on to someone else…I have made my living since the early 80’s finding gold so I know  a little about finding it…Art

This is a great topic and I have enjoyed the posts!
I want to mention the post with the picture of the detector set up is very interesting for regular (conventional ) signal transmission. The device I have works differently and is new technology (patented) so you won't be seeing it in the name brand adds. I agree that the LRL market is a niche one. If you had invented this new thing would you let anyone else have it ...not me until I had already found enough that would give me everything I want. Call it greed; I am just saying I'm being practical. That is the reason I don't reveal the name of the device I use.
Not wanting to be disagreeable but the device I own will pinpoint the ELEMENT you have it set for, I do mean pinpoint as in right on. The distance (thru the air) I checked was ½ mile. I did find a match head sized gold nugget near Redding CA from 1/8 mile away. The depth is suppose to be good for at least 200 feet, I have confirmed it will work 10 feet thru solid concrete, plan to test it above a cave by putting a silver dollar in the cave and then standing above the thing which would be close to 100 feet. Will do it sometime soon.

How about size-mic echo charting?  (spelling) I bet you could get the same people that look for oil in the ground to do a sizemic survey, where they come out with 10 gauge shells and pulse the ground and listen with there big tire... looking for ground echos... they go pretty deep.

There.  Its' been done.

Seismic would work as long as you are right on top of the object or in its real close vicinity.  They primarily use for it is real deep imaging 30+ meters to find larger anomalies.  Smaller targets get lost in the chatter.

I want to again thank Marc for allowing this forum…I know his other try’s  at allowing this subject to be discussed (if you can describe it as a discussion ) have always ended in disaster.  This one seems to be headed the same way…There is a myth that all these manufactures have become rich selling these devices. I personal know 3 of these manufactures.  None of them are what I consider as being rich.
I seriously think that less than 5,000 of these units have been sold while the skeptics report thousands of the buyers  feel they have been scammed.  I can not confirm or deny this allegation…

The only thing that I can say for sure is they work for me..I have suffered many personal attacks on a daily basis…This is just the way things are done when you can Dowse or use a LRL. Until some known Scientist wants to spend millions of dollars to run a big test of this subject will always be the same..Art 

I want to again thank Marc for allowing this forum…I know his other try’s  at allowing this subject to be discussed (if you can describe it as a discussion ) have always ended in disaster.  This one seems to be headed the same way…There is a myth that all these manufactures have become rich selling these devices. I personal know 3 of these manufactures.  None of them are what I consider as being rich.
I seriously think that less than 5,000 of these units have been sold while the skeptics report thousands of the buyers  feel they have been scammed.  I can not confirm or deny this allegation…

The only thing that I can say for sure is they work for me..I have suffered many personal attacks on a daily basis…This is just the way things are done when you can Dowse or use a LRL. Until some known Scientist wants to spend millions of dollars to run a big test of this subject will always be the same..Art 

Art. Reliable references and sources have been posted in regards to scientific testing of these contraptions. The conclusions and results are always the same. Does not work better than random guessing.

Furthermore, reliable references and sources have been posted in regards to tens of thousands of dollars that have been scammed from the US Government, as well as foreign Governments still being scammed by these contraptions.

I am glad your dowsing/treasure hunting works for you. However, your constant denial of presented facts, your constant bickering with those that have done the research and provided the requested data...are also forms of personal attacks. Even this post, that is filled with self-pity, is more than evident of your personal attacks.

Art. Reliable references and sources have been posted in regards to scientific testing of these contraptions. The conclusions and results are always the same. Does not work better than random guessing.

Furthermore, reliable references and sources have been posted in regards to tens of thousands of dollars that have been scammed from the US Government, as well as foreign Governments still being scammed by these contraptions.

Gee SWR….A bomb detector that happens to look like a L….Two body detectors…Can these products by even remotely connected to using a LRL to find treasure?  Art

Art. Reliable references and sources have been posted in regards to scientific testing of these contraptions. The conclusions and results are always the same. Does not work better than random guessing.

Furthermore, reliable references and sources have been posted in regards to tens of thousands of dollars that have been scammed from the US Government, as well as foreign Governments still being scammed by these contraptions.

Gee SWR….A bomb detector that happens to look like a L….Two body detectors…Can these products by even remotely connected to using a LRL to find treasure?  Art

Well kind Sir...had you actually read the scientific documentation you requested, and was provided...you would have read the portion about how these gimmicks were used by treasure hunters BEFORE they crossed over to other applications, such as dowsing for explosives

Well kind Sir...had you actually read the scientific documentation you requested, and was provided...you would have read the portion about how these gimmicks were used by treasure hunters BEFORE they crossed over to other applications, such as dowsing for explosives

Well…Your view of Scientific documentation is a lot different than my views…The explosives device is what failed the so called Scientific test. No test has ever been undertaken to prove if LRL’s as used for treasure hunting  work or not….Just pure fact with ….Art

Well kind Sir...had you actually read the scientific documentation you requested, and was provided...you would have read the portion about how these gimmicks were used by treasure hunters BEFORE they crossed over to other applications, such as dowsing for explosives

Well…Your view of Scientific documentation is a lot different than my views…The explosives device is what failed the so called Scientific test. No test has ever been undertaken to prove if LRL’s as used for treasure hunting  work or not….Just pure fact with ….Art

Art. One can hardly expect a scientific test of treasure hunting. Hunting for unknown buried treasure. It just ain't realistic.

However, laboratory held scientific tests have concluded that these gimmicks do not locate ANY metals. Period.
Your failure to accept scientific tests/results are understandable. Nobody likes to be on the losing team.

However, laboratory held scientific tests have concluded that these gimmicks do not locate ANY metals. Period.
Your failure to accept scientific tests/results are understandable. Nobody likes to be on the losing team.

I would not expect a device that is designed to find bombs and human beings to find Metal…If you have a web site I can go to find where  a Scientific Test of a LRL designed to find Metal   has been studied please post it…If you can not post it I will assume you have no proof…Art

[the gimmick was made for treasure hunting FIRST]

However, laboratory held scientific tests have concluded that these gimmicks do not locate ANY metals. Period.
Your failure to accept scientific tests/results are understandable. Nobody likes to be on the losing team.

I would not expect a device that is designed to find bombs and human beings to find Metal…If you have a web site I can go to find where  a Scientific Test of a LRL designed to find Metal   has been studied please post it…If you can not post it I will assume you have no proof…Art

See...ya just don't read, Art. The gimmick was a LRL....designed/invented/used for treasure hunting...locating gold. THEN...the same gimmick was sold under the guise of locating explosives.

Again...in bold...the gimmick was made for treasure hunting FIRST

I've posted websites for you til I'm blue in the face...and, getting tired of your same DUH responses  

This is a Treasure Hunting Forum. So, show the reports about it's use in Treasure Hunting.  Ain't nobody here hunting explosives. When we do we will ask your advice. Until then, kindly stick with the theme.  Dell

[DUH!]

DUH! This is a Treasure Hunting Forum. So, show the reports about it's use in Treasure Hunting.  Ain't nobody here hunting explosives. When we do we will ask your advice. Until then, kindly stick with the theme.  Dell

The theme (giggles) is METAL DETECTING. Ain't nobody here a huntin' fer metal?

 

Sadly, this is hypothetical...

I know 3 chests of gold are buried - somewhere within 300 acres...  at 8 feet deep.  There is no (or very little) iron buried with the cache.

How do I locate them?

This is the official re-opening of the TreasureNet Long Range Locator Forum.


PLEASE NOTE: As the administrator, creator and owner of this site, I HAVE SEEN PEOPLE GET RIPPED OFF (defrauded) by people selling so-called "long range locators" (devices, that supposedly, can find precious metals at a distance).  I HIGHLY recommend consulting a geophysicist ($100 in consulting fees could save you thousands, and you'll learn something!), before spending ONE DIME ON ANY "long range locator" .  With that, I open this forum to the discussion of said devices.  

Marc, We have a reputable Geophysicist consultant, that will tell you flat out that MFD can't possibly work. Yet, we have sent him GPR & Ground resisitivity data from numerous sites located with an  LRL, and not all, but most of the data he analyzed for us has shown an anomaly at the LRL locations. It's more than coincidence.   Dell

Marc, We have a reputable Geophysicist consultant, that will tell you flat out that MFD can't possibly work.

I can point you to countless scientists that will tell you that Ouija Boards don't work, yet, I have seen them work.  

I have one I'll sell you for $15000!  

I can point you to countless scientists that will tell you that Ouija Boards don't work, yet, I have seen them work.  

My comments on Ouija...

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,298094.msg2153579.html#msg2153579
http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,298094.msg2154691.html#msg2154691

[FIRMLY!]

I don't care what anyone says about the board.  Really.  It doesn't work - IT DOESN'T!!!!!  it's a game....  IT IS!!!!!  OK!    I recommend people NOT use it.

If I hadn't seen what I HAVE seen, I would be FIRMLY in the non-believers (skeptics) camp!!!!!!   FIRMLY!  

Of course, here is my story.....

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,28494.0.html

... and I have spent 30+ years TRYING to rationalize it away.  

Soon, I will complete the discovery - um, I mean recovery process.  

12 feet to the floor....  12 feet...  of course, we had NO way of knowing that.  

Maybe the ideomotor effect can tap into the subconscious and possibly psychic - and possibly genetic memory of the brain.  How can orphaned elephants find their way to the same water their ancestors survived on?  

I don't think most people understand the difference between things like ouija boards and LRL's. The ouija boards operate in the "astral" realm--"largely created by human desires and is therefore largely illusory in one sense although real enough when we are immersed in it."

Compare this with the term "etheric"--"often used for these more subtle energies, and this term means those energies associated with the blueprint underlying all physical form...Etheric fields carry the patterns for growth in all the kingdoms of nature. We can therefore view our own electromagnetic field as the mirror image of the etheric or magnetoelectric fields..."

The above quotes came from the book 'The Vivaxis Connection--Healing Through Earth Energies" by Judy Jacka

Hey Marc….All these experts have not experienced the things that we have..I don’t need to know exactly how something works..If it  finds treasure I am going to use it…As long as I don’t hurt some one with my tools I am the only one I have to prove any thing to…Art

Carl, I see you speak as if what you say is fact. I never realized  you were an authority on Ouija boards, and demonic possession. Is that included in your resume as an EE  

Marc, I realize you are mocking when you offer to sell an Oujia board for 15000, but in comparison, it is akin to my degreed electronic rivals selling Frequency generator LRL's  using L-Rod Antenna's  for $2,000 - $20,000. Some have been sold for up to $100,000.

Unfortunately, we are indoctrinated to believing that, if you want the best, you have to pay for it, or, you get what you pay for.

As a result my $75 Discriminators are no competition whatsoever for LRL's manufactured by folks with electronic degree's selling their products for  $2,000, or more, and yet they work equally well.

Ironically, or intentionally,  as you know I have been the focus of the attacks and  bashings on the internet that have been directed at  me for the past 15 years by folks in the Electronic industry.

So, Kudo's, and big bucks go  to the Electronics people for their promotion & advertising of their "Better" technology LRL's,  and their  EE cohorts, and supporters that bash and discredit those they feel are unqualified in electronics, to keep out the unwanted competetion.   Dell

[FIRMLY!]

I don't care what anyone says about the board.  Really.  It doesn't work - IT DOESN'T!!!!!  it's a game....  IT IS!!!!!  OK!    I recommend people NOT use it.

If I hadn't seen what I HAVE seen, I would be FIRMLY in the non-believers (skeptics) camp!!!!!!   FIRMLY!  

Of course, here is my story.....

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,28494.0.html

... and I have spent 30+ years TRYING to rationalize it away.
Soon, I will complete the discovery - um, I mean recovery process.  

12 feet to the floor....  12 feet...  of course, we had NO way of knowing that.  

Maybe the ideomotor effect can tap into the subconscious and possibly psychic - and possibly genetic memory of the brain.  How can orphaned elephants find their way to the same water their ancestors survived on?  

Marc, first of all  I want you to know that what you have experienced it's absolutely true.
This subject is highly complex,  long and I deal with it for decades.

Am I an authority to speak about it? Honestly, I am. I know what I am talking about.
I will not go deep into it, simply because this is not the right place to discuss it. This is a treasure hunting forum.
If you wish I can give you all information you need about this phenomena trough PM.

As a start, I will only tell you that an ouija board is one of the many ways used for entity comunications. Ouija board, moving glasses, pendulums, and others. It's not a game. Luck on you that the right entity gave you the right information. There are many false info from entities who only wants to have fun at people's expenses.
I am not kidding. This is serious.

As an initial research material for you to look on from the tons available, I cite the documented case of the Fox sisters in Hydesville in 1800's. You will probably only find disclaimer sources that it did not happen as they tell, that they cheated, etc. Discard that as these were written by the matherialistic involved who did not want the case to prosper. Focus on the similarity with your case.
Then try to get a scientific book called The Spirits' Book by Allan Kardek. This book is originally french written in 1857. Don't know how easy it will be to find it in US, but I know there's a version in english. I already saw it.

I will not make any coment about it here.
As you experienced this yourself, you will probably not be understood by the ones who did not experience it.
If you wish PM me. I will gladly discuss this with you.

Best regards.
PS. Found it easy in the net. Here:
http://www.espirito.org.br/portal/download/pdf/en/the-spirits-book.pdf

I don't think most people understand the difference between things like ouija boards and LRL's. The ouija boards operate in the "astral" realm--"largely created by human desires and is therefore largely illusory in one sense although real enough when we are immersed in it."

Compare this with the term "etheric"--"often used for these more subtle energies, and this term means those energies associated with the blueprint underlying all physical form...Etheric fields carry the patterns for growth in all the kingdoms of nature. We can therefore view our own electromagnetic field as the mirror image of the etheric or magnetoelectric fields..."

The above quotes came from the book 'The Vivaxis Connection--Healing Through Earth Energies" by Judy Jacka

One more note: "...once psychic, or astral energy is involved, the accuracy of the reading can be in doubt. The practitioner must have very stable emotions and an unbiased mind or the answer will be conditioned by their own psyche."

Map dowsing and ouija boards fit into this "astral" category, but some people wrongly think this includes all forms of dowsing and even LRL's. And no one is stopping a person from attempting to use them is this way. No doubt this can lead to confusion and even a negative attitude.

Since at least the late 1980's a few people have been trying to distinguish the difference between "physical" and "mental" dowsing. Perhaps these terms are not accurate.

Howdy Folks!
I have been reading all the posts in this thread and am a bit startled at some of
the debate. We certainly can examine a topic without bombasity and discord, I
hope anyhow.

Since I haven't got a dog in this fight, but am interested in any technology that
might benefit me in my quest to improve my personal fortunes, I stumbled into
this thread wondering what the story on LRLs might actually be. I've heard those
who are enthusiastic about these devices, and I've heard from folks on the other
side of the issue. What I haven't seen is any documentation from either side.
Granted, I just got interested in this particular line of discussion, and while such
documentation may have appeared on this forum or another before, I haven't
seen any of it.

My particular perspective is that of a person curious and without a specific point
of view. I am open to hearing legitimate opinions from both the skeptics and the
believers. While I am not precisely "in the market" for one of these devices, I am
open to the concept that there may be validity to claims they are efficacious. I am
equally open to the concept that such devices are not effective. I don't have any
bais one way or another.

I'd be curious to experiment with such devices and see what my own experience
might be. However, I run on a pretty slim budget and don't have any cash to
dispose of without something more inspiring than contention between different
factions in a discussion such as this.

As for Ouija boards, I've read Marc's account. It isn't surprising to me in the least.
They do open portals to entities from realms beyond our own physical plane. That
being said, I tend to regard them as perilous devices in much the same way as I
regard leaving my front door unlocked at night as unwise. Anything (or anybody)
can come through that portal and behave badly.

But since the whole point of this thread seems to be whether LRL devices actually
perform in a satisfactory manner to assist in treasure hunting, well, I'm open to
documentation from both sides, without prejudice to either. I have no bias one
way or the other. When I was young, the discriminating detector did not yet exist.
It would have seemed logical for folks to suggest that it ain't possible to discriminate
between various metals as we now take for granted. Pulse detectors are even more
recent, and achieve greater depth that only about 20 years ago would have been
unbelievable. I can imagine discussion of those technologies running along similar
lines as we see for the LRL machines. As noted by Hamlet; "There are more things
on heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy Horatio!"

So, rather than making this post much longer than it already is, I'd love to see what
documentation either side has to share. Whether it be websites, print articles or any
other medium, I'm open to seeing what evidence exists on either end of the debate.
Please feel free, on either side of the issue, to contact me via email or PM through
this forum.

Until I know more, I simply remain curious. And I hope this thread continues without
venom on either side so we can evaluate information based on merit rather than
sentiment or opinion.

Thank you for reading all this,
Blessings,
M-Taliesin

So, rather than making this post much longer than it already is, I'd love to see what
documentation either side has to share. Whether it be websites, print articles or any
other medium, I'm open to seeing what evidence exists on either end of the debate.
Please feel free, on either side of the issue, to contact me via email or PM through
this forum.

Huh?? Documentation by opponents have been shared in practically every thread in this sub-forum. Several threads have even been about documentation how these gimmicks are manufactured.    

So, rather than making this post much longer than it already is, I'd love to see what
documentation either side has to share. Whether it be websites, print articles or any
other medium, I'm open to seeing what evidence exists on either end of the debate.
Please feel free, on either side of the issue, to contact me via email or PM through
this forum.

Huh?? Documentation by opponents have been shared in practically every thread in this sub-forum. Several threads have even been about documentation how these gimmicks are manufactured.    

Howdy!
I didn't read practially every thread in this forum. I read this one in particular.
Documentation about how gimmicks, as you call them, are made isn't relevant.
I am interested in documentation on how they perform. Can anybody document
a find made with such device. Or, by contrast, why they aren't able to find anything.

I am not so interested as to read every thread on the forum dealing with this particular
modality. Just a curious onlooker who is open to considering both points of view.
If that point of view can't be made in a consice, yet compelling way right here, then
it really isn't an investment in time to go looking for source material on my own.

Noted that your reply didn't offer a single reference to another thread where such
questions are addressed. That leaves me wondering why not? It is routine to provide
links to specific threads or documentation when replying to a simple question and
would require much less typing simply to provide them in response to a question.

Again, I ain't got no dog in this fight either way and don't have any emotional
involvement in this discussion. Just a curiosity that isn't so consuming that I'm going
to read every thread on the forum in order to satisfy.

If these things work, show me.
If they don't, show me.
Until that happens, I guess I'll just chalk down what I've seen in this thread as
opinion and hearsay without evidence. Until then, I ain't launching an investigation,
and I ain't buying the argument from either side. All I'm asking is for folks to show
their hand.

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,289835.0.html

If that point of view can't be made in a consice, yet compelling way right here, then
it really isn't an investment in time to go looking for source material on my own.

Please see my PM.   

If these things work, show me.
If they don't, show me.
Until that happens, I guess I'll just chalk down what I've seen in this thread as
opinion and hearsay without evidence. Until then, I ain't launching an investigation,
and I ain't buying the argument from either side. All I'm asking is for folks to show
their hand.

Okey dokey...you've already got your mind up, I reckon. If you don't want to read the posts in this forum, then I'll just move along. Nothing to see here. 

If these things work, show me.
If they don't, show me.
Until that happens, I guess I'll just chalk down what I've seen in this thread as
opinion and hearsay without evidence. Until then, I ain't launching an investigation,
and I ain't buying the argument from either side. All I'm asking is for folks to show
their hand.

Hi M-T,

There's heaping gobs of show-me on my personal web site, http://www.geotech1.com. Try these links:

LRL Main page
LRL General Info (esp. read the Dowsing/LRL Q&A)
LRL Technical Reports - Look inside lots of LRLs

- Carl

If these things work, show me.
If they don't, show me.
Until that happens, I guess I'll just chalk down what I've seen in this thread as
opinion and hearsay without evidence. Until then, I ain't launching an investigation,
and I ain't buying the argument from either side. All I'm asking is for folks to show
their hand.

Hi M-T,

There's heaping gobs of show-me on my personal web site, http://www.geotech1.com. Try these links:

LRL Main page
LRL General Info (esp. read the Dowsing/LRL Q&A)
LRL Technical Reports - Look inside lots of LRLs

- Carl

Howdy Carl!
Thank you very much. I surely appreciate your providing specific information for me
to consider and view. I'll check it out when I have a bit of time. Morning struck early
today around here, but with a three day weekend coming along (with snow in the
forecast) guess I'll have ample opportunity to catch up on reading.

Much obliged, Carl, and thanks for the information.

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

If that point of view can't be made in a consice, yet compelling way right here, then
it really isn't an investment in time to go looking for source material on my own.

Please see my PM.   

Howdy Ted!
Much appreciate your information. I didn't get a chance to view it last night, but
have three days coming along with snow in the forecast, so should have a chance
to check it out and consider the information with an open mind.

Nice of you to take the time to PM me with that, and I really do appreciate it.
Thanks again!

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

All I'm asking is for folks to show their hand.

Okey dokey...you've already got your mind up, I reckon. If you don't want to read the posts in this forum, then I'll just move along. Nothing to see here. 

Howdy SWR!
Wow, but you folded quick enough. Works for me. Ya gotta know when to hold 'em,
know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away, etc, etc.

I haven't "already got your mind up", whatever on earth that's supposed to mean,
(and assume it was intended to be a slight) but am merely curious. I don't feel any
compulsion to reinvent the entire wheel, but just get to the crux of the thing without
putting in a bunch of time I ain't got.

But that's an okey dokey with me, if you ain't holding anything. Others have stepped
up and offered more than mere opinion, so I don't much mind you came up dry.
It's okay with me.

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

If these things work, show me.
If they don't, show me.

Taliesin,
Nobody needs to show you anything.
As Carl gave you the link to his site, do what I did.
I built some of the devices featured in his site, he claims not working. The ones I chose to build worked. Some better than others. But they worked. So my conclusion is that there's a high possibility that all of them work.
You'll see that there's nothing scientific in the reports, only biased opinions to support own beliefs.

So experiment yourself and do not 'import' claims from others, something that occurs very often among skeptics here.

Taliesin,
Nobody needs to show you anything.
As Carl gave you the link to his site, do what I did.
I built some of the devices featured in his site, he claims not working. The ones I chose to build worked. Some better than others. But they worked. So my conclusion is that there's a high possibility that all of them work.
You'll see that there's nothing scientific in the reports, only biased opinions to support own beliefs.

So experiment yourself and do not 'import' claims from others, something that occurs very often among skeptics here.

Well, M-Taliesin, isn't that almost exactly what I told you to do.

Of course it goes without saying there are some LRL salesmen (look ^^^^ up to see one) here too. They have other interests and agendas, other than just sharing info with you, so it is in your best interests to evaluate what they are pushing rather closely, especially before you part with any of your ready cash.

If all you are looking for is a fair evaluation of dowsing and LRL/MFD, done from your own personal angle, than I already gave you everything you'll need to conduct your investigation.

Good luck...
Ted  

Hey M-Taliesin….I own three of the devices that he has on his web site…I have also used 4 others that he has tested. That is seven good devise’s that  the experts say that will do nothing… I have told these guys over and over if you try to Dowse with a LRL you WILL fail…Art

A well informed consumer makes the most satisfied, and very best customer.      Dell

http://dowse.webs.com/apps/webstore/

Try with TREASURE NAVIGATOR (LONG RANGE LOCATOR)

Try with TREASURE NAVIGATOR (LONG RANGE LOCATOR)

Is this what you use?