Dave Ramsey trashes owning gold

[Waterworld]

Last night on his radio show he said under no circumstances should anyone own gold. His logic was than "gold itself has no intrinsic value" and that its value exists simply because people want it. He used the movie Waterworld, where they used dirt as a commodity, as an example that anything can have value as long as everybody wants it.

He dismissed its value in an economic collapse, citing the Hurricane Katrina aftermath. "People didn't buy stuff with gold then."

He believes that "the only people who think you should own gold are people who sell gold."

All I know is, if I had bought five ounces three years ago and cashed in today I would more than double my money. I wish someone had called him on that.

sounds like he's blowing smoke

A currncys value is only as good as the peoples faith in that currency. To me, people will always have faith in gold and it will always have a value.

You better make sure you "own" gold.  That is you have the real stuff IN your posession.  Not some piece of paper saying you "own" gold.

That's all I'm saying on this topic.

I said that was all I was going to say but actually what I have seen happen to a few people I know is exactly what Seamuss said.  These people thought they owned gold when all they really owned was worthless paper.

If it comes right down to brass tacks and the excrement hits the oscillating rotational cooling device you can bet that if you have said paper, it's not going to do you much good unless you need to start a fire.

If you want to "own" gold then the only real way is to possess the gold you own.

That is what I am trying to say on this issue.

Stock in mining companies can be risky if the company falls on hard times or is mismanaged.

Tell me about it. I inherited a lot of shares in one of the biggest gold mines in the north west. These were purchased B4 the great depression. They are now worthless, but they do look nice.

remember --gold in hand is gold --gold written down as "owned" on paper is a promise -- and promises get broken all the time.

The same argument can be said about the greenback. Greenbacks only hold their value if it's backed by something and it hasn't been backed by anything for decades.

The feds are printing money so fast now that it has no value to most people and banks are using some of their bailout money to buy physical gold.That along should make him wonder about his statement.

If there were something better to buy at this point in time , they would do so.
Ramsey is right, if the world economy collapses, gold and all the other artificially inflated
commodities would collapse along with the "futures" market/exchange.

Ted Turner has it worked out. He's invested in Bison.

the #1 real thing long term wize will be water purifaction --folks got to have clean water peroid -- right after that comes food --seeds and land to grow crops on -- livestock to eat --- shelter and clothing --- guns for defending your self and goods as well as for hunting game animals -- fishing gear to to catch fish with, cooking and building tools and supplies .--ie hard core basic staple items medical supplies , salt ,  gun powder& reloading goods

because when a hungry armed man meets a supplied unarmed man --he will not be a hungry man for long

This guy has a show about helpin' folks get out of debt. And in my oppinion he knows his stuff on that subject. He is no expert on gold. His expertise is in helping folks get out of debt.

 I believe what he was probably giving was his oppinion about owning gold. Think about it, if you are up to your eyeballs in debt, why would you waste your money on gold instead of trying to get out of debt first.

 Anyway, the man knows his stuff when it comes to gettin' out of debt.

I agree. Dave knows his stuff about getting people out of debt.

I agree with MC.
Dave gives very good advice on debt related subjects and also on some investment products, mostly
mutual funds that are "usually" pretty safe and stable over time, so I would agree with him on those things.
And he also says that you should do your home work on any investment and don't risk more than you can afford
to lose, I think anyone can agree with that regardless of what you invest in.

His advice on gold is a little shortsighted in my opinion.
The hurricane Katrina statement doesn't work because it was not a total economic break down, it was a localized disaster.
Paper money was still valued and was still accepted around that area as in the rest of the country.
The Waterworld statement has some truth to it. Rocks, shells, chicken bones, dogs teeth, seeds, gold, silver etc. have all
been used for money thoughout the history of man, so could dirt if we were a world devoid of land.
But p.m.'s was the best because they are rare and could not be made of common materials. And that's why they still hold some
value today. People chose the form of money they wanted not some king or government, the people did, and they chose p.m.'s
And if an economic break down happened, a currency WILL come about, maybe not overnight but it would not take long
for something to used, whether it is gold, silver, ammo, beer, clean water, seeds or shoelaces.
Bean
 

if our "paper" money becomes only useful as toilet paper -- say due to hyper inflation --dropping dollar value -- what will be the "new" money? ---simple the things you "really" need in your day to day life thats what-- traded via a barter based exchange system -- can you eat a fist full of worthless paper cash --or silver or gold? --- however everyone must have clean water and food as well --- medical supplies wil a prime item , gas or power / fuel supplies will be in demand -- guns to protect both yourself and goods and to hunt with.

tobacco and alcohol of course goes without question

when the s hits the fan --- who cares how many useless dollars you get for a oz of unusible gold -- I mean in a barter type use what good is it frankly? -- its only real usefulness is in high tech electric stuff and jewelry and dental fillings -- in other words its fairly useless in a basic type economy

I'd bet ole Dave has some gold. Some jewelry at least.
I think that gold will always have value. Even from neolithic times, gold has never been worth nothing...
I'd rather right now have $1000 worth of gold than $1000 in US Currency.
OK, I'd just like to have $1000. If I did, I'd buy gold!

Scott

the #1 real thing long term wize will be water purifaction --folks got to have clean water peroid -- right after that comes food --seeds and land to grow crops on -- livestock to eat --- shelter and clothing --- guns for defending your self and goods as well as for hunting game animals -- fishing gear to to catch fish with, cooking and building tools and supplies .--ie hard core basic staple items medical supplies , salt ,  gun powder& reloading goods

because when a hungry armed man meets a supplied unarmed man --he will not be a hungry man for long

What will people trade for those items? gold? labor? sex?  
I guess there will be trading posts where useful things will be traded for other useful things.

GG~

I dont know about others but I am starting to sell my gold holdings. Today I sell 20 ounces, tomorow another 20 ounces! anyone buying?.  http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,283461.0.html

The economic system we (the world in general) have now came about from a "basic economy" or barter type system.
P.m.'s were used then and for 1000's of years. You couldn't eat them or make useful tools out of them, but they were still
used as currency. What ever you could not produce yourself or if you couldn't do it good enough, (maybe you built a crappy
house or your crops keep dying). Then you would need to get those things from other people that could build it or grow
it right. Remember the barter system only works when people want or need the things you have to trade and vice versa.
Example: If you make really good knives it will be only a matter of time before everybody in your little town has one of your
knives, once that happens your knives have lost there value compared to other things, everybody has one so who needs it.
P.m's made things alot more simple, they don't lose there value when cut into small pieces for smaller purchases,
(a knife cut in small pieces is worthless). They also don't spoil or go stale like most food will, they virtually last forever.
This is why people still like p.m.'s to this day. If you have a stock pile of goods, a little gold and silver sure wouldn't hurt
anything, and if s*** doesn't hit the fan, maybe you could sell your p.m.'s to get back a little bit of that money you spent
on all the cans of pork and beans you now have collecting dust in your basement.
It is important to understand how money works, not so much in what object will be used as money.

Bean

Just saw a gold commercial on tv yesterday. The lady said: "If you had to hold it for 5 years would you rather someone give you $5000 in gold or $5000 in U.S. currency." I'm tending to think that the gold is going to be worth alot more than the paper in 5 years.
Getting out of debt is more important than owning gold. So is having some food and water stored up and maybe some firewood.
JMHO

[Waterworld]

Last night on his radio show he said under no circumstances should anyone own gold. His logic was than "gold itself has no intrinsic value" and that its value exists simply because people want it. He used the movie Waterworld, where they used dirt as a commodity, as an example that anything can have value as long as everybody wants it.

He dismissed its value in an economic collapse, citing the Hurricane Katrina aftermath. "People didn't buy stuff with gold then."

He believes that "the only people who think you should own gold are people who sell gold."

All I know is, if I had bought five ounces three years ago and cashed in today I would more than double my money. I wish someone had called him on that.

I suppose he should try to contact the Indian Central Bank about that 200 Billion in gold they purchased and tell them how stupid they were.

It seems to me that those in power in the US government especially will stop at nothing to discredit and confuse the masses so they can be lied to.

They scream don't buy gold, they talk about bubbles, they PAY other people like this radio DJ to badmouth it. Meanwhile they are buying up all they can find.

They are scum.

  If gold is so frickin worthless, then why was our currency based (at one time) on this metal.  Sounds to me like Ramsey is worthless.

To take Ramsey's use of waterworld in context, The reason dirt was worth so much, is because there was NO LAND. The whole basis of the movie was that there was a enormous flood which covered everything. 100% water. No Land. THe only cities were underwater. The people traded dirt because they could use it. Grow plants, feed people, etc.

Just my 2 cents.

Alex.

Oh, and I'd prefer to invest in silver, gold is too compact. The way I see it, if the s*** really does hit the fan, would you want to pay for a half dozen eggs and a loaf of bread with a $50 gold coin? How could you make change? What if someone saw it, and figured theres more where that came from? Im investing in junk silver. Its worth more to me.

If you have physical gold and want to trash it then I have room for it. I'm not proud. I'll take your trash and call it treasure.

Oh, and I'd prefer to invest in silver, gold is too compact. The way I see it, if the s*** really does hit the fan, would you want to pay for a half dozen eggs and a loaf of bread with a $50 gold coin? How could you make change? What if someone saw it, and figured theres more where that came from? Im investing in junk silver. Its worth more to me.

yeah, I'm investing in silver too, 10 ounces of silver, in my opinion, is worth more than an ounce of gold because people won't be able to make change when the dollar goes to zero because it'll be very hard for people to quantify value in terms of real money because we're all used to quantifying value in terms of monopoly money.  When you ask what the value of gold is, instead of saying 20 ounces of silver or 50 ounces of silver, we quote the value of gold in terms of dollars, same with silver, we don't base the value of silver as being equal to a set amount of another commodity, we base the value in dollars, so when the dollar becomes worthless nobody will be able to make change because nobody will know how to make change in terms of commodities because we've all been conditioned to make change in dollars, that is why I like silver better than gold.

Also, to get back on the topic of dave ramsey, I think the guy can be a total jerk because he's so cocky with his opinions and he can't tell the difference between facts and opinions when it comes to his own views.  That's just my opinion anyway.  Btw, for those of you who invest in mutual funds, what fees has your mutual fund company taken out of your money?  Did you know that you can be liable for the mutual fund's capital gains tax even if you yourself don't realize any capital gains from the investment?  I know this is alittle off topic, but since the topic was brought up because of the topic of dave ramsey was brought up, I thought I'd put my 2 cents out their too.  Personally, I think he's bought and paid for by the mutual fund companies he recommends, which is why I don't listen to him.

I'm assuming that this concept is what people mean when they talk about a "ratio." This is a very good topic, I think there is another thread that discusses some aspects of the "ratio" idea.
Back in the late 1800's, it was something like 16:1.
I have no idea what it is today...maybe 65:1?
If gold tumbles, does silver go along for the downward ride also?


Scott

I'm a huge fan of Dave, and have been listening to his show since it was called The Money Show. (Or was it called the Money Game?)

Anyway, I think Dave is referring to investing in gold on paper.

There have been tons of scams in the past, with the most common being the old scam of "we'll invest it for you." They take your money, put it into paper, and then "trade for you", making high commissions when they buy and sell for you, up to 10 times a week.

These scams and schemes used to be so popular that, I personally didn't know for years that you could walk into a coin shop and walk out with real bullion. I was given the impression that all the gold was held buy others, even though you could 'buy' it. These used to be advertised all the time on AM talk radio shows, about how you could get rich with gold for only a $10,000 investment.

I knew a guy that reluctantly told me about his gold investment. He 'invested' his money with one of those advertisers, and they promptly charged him a 'transfer fee' of $300, I think, just to buy the gold for him. They then 'traded' the gold at $40 per buy and sell, so in essence, they made $80 on each trade....and they did those trades until the investment was wiped out. This happened while gold was falling at a rapid rate.

That is why Dave dislikes gold as an investment....he isn't talking about guys like us...he's talking to the masses and basically saying "don't get taken by these scam artists".  And if we put ourselves in his seat for a few days, and you were advising the financial futures of millions of people, would you still recommend gold as an investment, knowing there are so many scams out there???   

I'm a huge fan of Dave, and have been listening to his show since it was called The Money Show. (Or was it called the Money Game?)

Anyway, I think Dave is referring to investing in gold on paper.

There have been tons of scams in the past, with the most common being the old scam of "we'll invest it for you." They take your money, put it into paper, and then "trade for you", making high commissions when they buy and sell for you, up to 10 times a week.

These scams and schemes used to be so popular that, I personally didn't know for years that you could walk into a coin shop and walk out with real bullion. I was given the impression that all the gold was held buy others, even though you could 'buy' it. These used to be advertised all the time on AM talk radio shows, about how you could get rich with gold for only a $10,000 investment.

I knew a guy that reluctantly told me about his gold investment. He 'invested' his money with one of those advertisers, and they promptly charged him a 'transfer fee' of $300, I think, just to buy the gold for him. They then 'traded' the gold at $40 per buy and sell, so in essence, they made $80 on each trade....and they did those trades until the investment was wiped out. This happened while gold was falling at a rapid rate.

That is why Dave dislikes gold as an investment....he isn't talking about guys like us...he's talking to the masses and basically saying "don't get taken by these scam artists".  And if we put ourselves in his seat for a few days, and you were advising the financial futures of millions of people, would you still recommend gold as an investment, knowing there are so many scams out there???   

That makes sense to me. 

Glad you resurrected my thread clovis cuz I couldn't believe what I heard Dave say last month. He actually endorsed a cash-for-gold mail order company, maybe the biggest scammers to surface since PMs went up. Is he just naive about gold?

Most all "talk radio" personalities are driven by advertising revenue.
Do the math...

Best,
Scott

Most all "talk radio" personalities are driven by advertising revenue.
Do the math...

I find it amazing that he's willing to risk his good reputation for advertising revenue. A few shady endorsements and people will start questioning his advice.

Gold will always be worth something. We used to barter for things in the past and it sucked, the things we barter for are not compact and cannot be stored for long times. That's when people switched to precious metals, they are compact and able to retain their value for a long time, unlike ammo, food, etc. The first few years after a SHTF event would be bartering, but afterwords, gold, silver, and copper will regain their rightful place as currency. Think what a gold coin bought in the old days..

HH
-GC

Glad you resurrected my thread clovis cuz I couldn't believe what I heard Dave say last month. He actually endorsed a cash-for-gold mail order company, maybe the biggest scammers to surface since PMs went up. Is he just naive about gold?

I listen to Dave so much that I could almost recite that very commercial, LOL.

I too, am a bit perplexed by his endorsement for "gold stash for cash". As sharp as he is about a wide variety of things, I wonder if DR is just clueless about gold and the industry.

Either way, I still like DR. I don't agree with every word that comes out of his mouth, but his basic message is solid and clear. I've worked the plan twice...the first time while I was single, and a second time when I got married, and the wife had debt.



 

 

The Dave haters are going to love today's episode...

Dave railed on gold as an investment again today. Paraphrasing what he says:

1. Gold is a bubble right now @ $1400 an ounce.
2. Gold is an emotional purchase, that is fear based.
3. Gold has a lower return on investment, as a long term value, even though it has had a 23% ROI in the past 5 years.
4. Gold is not a common currency if stuff hits the fan.

Let's not forget that these are Dave's thoughts, not mine. Nonetheless, I still think DR is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I have my own opinions on the topic. 




 

I think if it ever gets to the point that we need gold to make transactions that the govmt. would make it illegal as they did in the past. It would be far easier to use silver for most daily bartering anyway. As far as Dave goes, I tuned out years ago when I heard him say to pay off the highest balance credit cards first as opposed to paying off the ones with the highest interest rate first. Unless that is some sort of get over the hump mental strategy, I don't understand. Yes I bought his book and another he suggested... And I think owning physical gold is great!

Of course gold wasn't used after Katrina hit!.....................for a number of reasons.  First of all, how many poor blacks in New Orleans have a stash of gold? This is not meant to be racial, it's just the facts.  Then, who waited to see how they were going to get supplies?  Not many; the looting started almost immediately and continued for days. If you are already prepared, you won't have to get involved in the looting and expose yourself and family to the dangers that will surely manifest. Eventually the good ol' government stepped in and issued them "credit" or "debit" cards to use.  That was hilarious.......where in the heck were they supposed to shop......the looted out stores?? A lot of that money was spent on booze, smokes and traded for drugs.  Much of the money was issued to people that didn't even get affected by Katrina. Heck, after that tsunami hit Sri Lanka a few years back, governments around the world threw tons of money at the country for rebuilding infrastructure and businesses better than they ever were. There were a lot of victims that received nothing but, many over there call it "The Golden Wave". Katrina was a very concentrated disaster, it wasn't millions of people wondering where their next meal was coming from. When that does happen I agree totally with Ivan and the list he made.  We have everything on that list (and then some) covered already except for the medical supplies and salt. I also agree that gold will have too much value to make day-to-day black market purchases with.  It's the people that have prepared or somewhat prepared ahead of time that will get by until the cavalry shows up. One ounce silver coins will be far more useable in times such as those, as will ammo.  

I think if it ever gets to the point that we need gold to make transactions that the govmt. would make it illegal as they did in the past. It would be far easier to use silver for most daily bartering anyway. As far as Dave goes, I tuned out years ago when I heard him say to pay off the highest balance credit cards first as opposed to paying off the ones with the highest interest rate first. Unless that is some sort of get over the hump mental strategy, I don't understand. Yes I bought his book and another he suggested... And I think owning physical gold is great!

I'm going to split hairs here...

Dave actually says to list all of your debts from lowest to highest, and pay off the lowest debt first, then the next lowest, and so on. His method says to basically throw everything you can into paying off those, and once you have the smallest paid off, roll what you would have paid into the next smallest one, and to make minimum payments anything else, until you get to that one.

It is a "get over the hump' mental thing. I remember back in '96 working his plan, and I was sooo excited to have my smallest debt, a $400 charge at a clothing store, paid off. You'd have thought I had just paid off $40,000! Man, was I ever excited!!!! I was so stoked to get onto my next highest balance of $550, and got it knocked out in record time. Then it was onto the next highest of $950, also knocked out lickety-split. By the time I hit my highest debt of $5,000, I knew that it was just a matter of hard work and a number of months to pay that silly thing off.  

I agree with Dave though. The highest balance debt of $5,000 seemed impossible to pay off to me when I first started the plan. And when you really add up the interest from the highest rates, what would it add up to? A few hundred bucks? (Especially before 2008 when the CC companies jacked rates through the roof.)  

This is what DR calls the debt snowball, BTW.

To each their own, though. If you like gold, go for it.  

    

Packerbacker, you have some very good points.

He believes that "the only people who think you should own gold are people who sell gold."

All I know is, if I had bought five ounces three years ago and cashed in today I would more than double my money. I wish someone had called him on that.

Actually if that's his point I agree with him

& So should you.

Only reason to own it is to sell it at a profit.
Holding on to it till you die makes no sense to me.

Then someone else Profits.

Jeff, I don't get that "hold it until you die" mentality either.

This past summer, a local estate had an auction, and the coin collection sold. The largest part of it was gold, which sold for nearly $1400 per coin (including 10% buyers premium) to a refinery buyer. 28 gold coins sold for well in excess of $30,000.

The estate was in trust, and their were no surviving family members, so I am told.

   

Owning gold is better then owning the greenback but there is a fine line in owning it just to hold it. Unless you can buy it really cheap like I did and sell it high like stocks then it would be better to dig it up and stock pile a few ounces so it doesn't cost you $1400 per ounce to aquire and hoard for years to make money on it. Silver is still a good buy for now but will be at a premium in a few more years like gold which will still go up a little for a while.
Do I have a few ounces of each, yes, but I'm not totally invested in either. I do believe in holding some gold and silver and will continue to hold some of each.

the #1 real thing long term wize will be water purifaction --folks got to have clean water peroid -- right after that comes food --seeds and land to grow crops on -- livestock to eat --- shelter and clothing --- guns for defending your self and goods as well as for hunting game animals -- fishing gear to to catch fish with, cooking and building tools and supplies .--ie hard core basic staple items medical supplies , salt ,  gun powder& reloading goods

because when a hungry armed man meets a supplied unarmed man --he will not be a hungry man for long

Couldnt have said it better myself.... Stocking up has been my priority for the last 6 months... The big problem with my (and your) theory though is.... If I cant get gas to fuel up my truck, how the hell am I going to haul said supplies around???
Thats EXACTLY the reason why I am planning for a move to an area where I can cache a big load of the stuff (foodstuffs, ammo, weapons, etc) in a place that I could hide/live and only needed to worry about "hoofing" it to that spot... But I suppose that is a whole nother thread.. LOL..

Like King Solomon advised long ago, "Invest in seven ventures, yes, in eight;
   you do not know what disaster may come upon the land." In other words diversify. Cash on hand, some gold/silver, mutual funds, stock indexes, real estate, guns and ammo, food stores, etc. I think it comes down to balance and temperance. If one sector/investment goes south then, hopefully, everything else with cushion or soften the blow.

Seajay

Last night on his radio show he said under no circumstances should anyone own gold. His logic was than "gold itself has no intrinsic value" and that its value exists simply because people want it.

I too believe Dave knows his stuff on debt reduction, but the statement above totally contradicts itself.  Did he really says this, or are you paraphrasing him?  If people "want" something, it has VALUE!  That is the definition of value.

Gold has value to humans for thousands of years and will continue to have value.

With that said, I am more interested in buying silver.  JMO.
Dan

That was an actual quote. He doesn't realize how absurd that is. Using that philosophy, nothing has intrinsic value.

I don't listen to him regularly but has he said anything about silver? Or is his belief about gold consistant for all PMs.

Just wanted to clear up that I'm not a Dave hater at all. I used his method to wipe out about $4K in debt several years ago, and I didn't even realize it! (A friend passed it off as her advice)

I used his method to wipe out about $4K in debt several years ago, and I didn't even realize it! (A friend passed it off as her advice)

And he borrowed it from others. The idea of rolling over debt payments has been around for a long time. Every now and then some guru comes along and tries to brand the idea his own by calling it a snowball, vortex, whatever.  Easier to borrow common sense than to create common sense.

I agree with a lot of his stuff, but question some too. He favors mutual funds too much for my taste. If the economy totally collapses, his mutual funds will be worthless too. Some security.

I'm not so sure about buying a ton of gold now in case it is a bubble that crashes soon. If the steep increase in price continues, then I think we are in trouble as an economy. Doesn't speak well for the value of the dollar. Wish my wages were going up that fast.

But at least the gold is tangible when compared to mutual funds. Even if you lost some money on it, you will still have something.

I have noticed that to.  I like Dave Ramsey on everything he says but that.  Kind of shame I think.  Wonder what is reason is.  I'm sure there is a story.

He can have his paper money , and if you look back over the thousands of years Gold and Silver is what was wanted and used. It may not be of much value for awhile if there is a huge collapse , but it will be not to long after as Nations put them selves back together .   
 
  Now I can see not basing everything in gold only .   

Dave Ramsey knows his stuff - no doubt about that.

I think you need to extrapolate on what he said about gold.  Sell it - pay off your debts.

Though I don't think he "gets" gold ownership, I think his major point is that it is stupid to own gold when you are thousands of dollars in debt.


Beth

With a several thousand year track record Ill stick with gold.

  I am still not sure about Dave but I will say this. The difference between the depression of the 30s and what could happen now is that people owned their property and as a rule did not lug around near the debt that we do now.. that could make a depression now the most cataclysmic event to hit this nation since its inception. Pay off debt,, and then prepare your house. I like gold, I like silver better.

No arguement here - I'll take precious metals over just about anything else.  No matter what, someone will always be willing to trade you something for gold and silver.

Of course, we're going to hope that everyone got some before it reached the price it is now. 


B

Dave said the same thing about one year ago about silver.  A woman called him for his advice because her husband wanted to invest a large sum of money in physical silver and she was concerned.  Dave told the woman on air that her husband was an idiot and not to let him do it.  Silver was like 17 an ounce then.  So who is the real idiot.

Yep, I've definitely heard him say things like that.  He does not appreciate the value of precious metals.

He did a whole show about 8 months or so ago about it.  The only 2 valid reasons I heard (and of course, he had lots of other reasons), was not to buy stuff when you are in debt, that investment comes after paying off debt, and the second thing he said was that the government can make precious metal ownership null and void with the stroke of a pen - which is true and has happened before.

He thinks a good fund that pays 12% no matter what, is the way to go.  IMO, the answer is really somewhere in the middle. Have a good retirement account (run by yourself), and buy gold and silver.  Precious metals are volatile, like oil, goes up and down - but always has a value.

Beth

I'm not a "Doom and Gloomer", but I wonder what Dave would say after reading this article or looked at the FDIC list for weekly failed banks?

http://news.goldseek.com/InternationalForecaster/1301848531.php
 

http://www.fdic.gov/bank/individual/failed/banklist.html

 Even though the first link/article is from those that eat, drink, and sleep on Gold and Silver, it's worth understanding some other's points of view.... It gets to the point toward the last.... 
 
It seems that for the coming days of 2011, JUST keeping what you've got is going to be a gamble.  It's going to take work finding ways to keep what little dirt and dollars that we've spent our lifetime WORKING for....
 

I went to some Ramsey seminar broadcast at a local church in early 2009. This was right after the "big bailout mess" started rollin'.

Ramsey was taking questions from the live audience via the web and someone asked about investing in gold and silver. He said something similar to the first post but I remember his quote being something like "gold and silver are just rocks". Rambled on about how the stock market consistently outperformed all the precious metals.  

Whoops!

Like someone else mentioned - he should stick to helping people get out of debt because he really missed the mark on that particular question.

Couple points to make about Dave Ramsey and gold.  First, Dave Ramsey is worth several hundred million dollars, so I have to believe he knows a thing or 20 about making money.  Second you never hear of billionaires buying up massive quantities of gold.  And they know a thing or 25 about making money. 

My wife and I went through the program and paid off almost 25k and saved an additional 10k to get my wife a decent car over a period of 2 years and an income of 60k.  We now are stable enough that I don't have to have a job while I go to school for 2 years.  Call me crazy, but I believe Dave.

Real estate will have the highest value when it hits the fan and assuming gold will have any value in a collapsed economy, your 5k or 10k in saved gold won't get you through it.  Sell your gold, buy some land, real estate value has a better track record.

I'm a Clark Howard man myself. I've never heard him trash precious metals, and he didn't go bankrupt in the real estate market like Dave Ramsey did. He also doesn't get all "preachy" during his broadcasts.

I'm a Clark Howard man myself. I've never heard him trash precious metals, and he didn't go bankrupt in the real estate market like Dave Ramsey did. He also doesn't get all "preachy" during his broadcasts.

The fact that he went bankrupt 25 years ago and his net worth now is several hundred million dollars actually lends credibility to the fact that his process works.  And he gets preachy because many of his ideas come from the bible, so there you go.

[Second you never hear of billionaires buying up massive quantities of gold. And they know a thing or 25 about making money.]

Couple points to make about Dave Ramsey and gold.  First, Dave Ramsey is worth several hundred million dollars, so I have to believe he knows a thing or 20 about making money.  Second you never hear of billionaires buying up massive quantities of gold.  And they know a thing or 25 about making money. 

My wife and I went through the program and paid off almost 25k and saved an additional 10k to get my wife a decent car over a period of 2 years and an income of 60k.  We now are stable enough that I don't have to have a job while I go to school for 2 years.  Call me crazy, but I believe Dave.

Real estate will have the highest value when it hits the fan and assuming gold will have any value in a collapsed economy, your 5k or 10k in saved gold won't get you through it.  Sell your gold, buy some land, real estate value has a better track record.

I don't know who Dave Ramsey is and have never listened to him, so I cannot comment on what he says.

However, your comment about billionaires intrigues me.  I am wondering how many billionaires, or even millionaires you know and have spoken to about their investments?   You might be correct though that not many of them have been buying gold in the past, in the sense that sometimes it takes a while for certain investments to take hold.  I would bet that as time goes on and our economy further tanks more billionaires and millionaires will convert some of the wealth into PMs.  Just because someone has that much wealth does not necessarily mean they know everything about investments per se.  Some have inherited their wealth and some have specific niche areas that have made them wealthy, but that does not mean they know everything there is to know about how to preserve that wealth over time as the economy changes.  Fortunes are lost and made constantly.

I do know a couple of coin dealers very well, and they have told me in the past that they have regular customers who buy $100K-$250K in gold and silver (mostly gold) EACH month for several months at a time, and some for the past couple of years.  While they are probably not billionaires, they have to be fairly wealthy to be able to afford that.  Further, very wealthy folks tend to be quite secretive about their investments and won't go blabbing on a blog, forum or the news about what they own. 

Real estate right now is a terrible investment unless it is farm land or similar.  You will see residential and commercial real estate fall further into the next couple of years in my opinion.  At some time it will be very wise to convert some PMs into residential or commercial real estate, but I would not be doing that now personally.

Foreign central banks have been loading up on tons of gold in the recent past.  I believe they might know something that us "little people" don't know.   But I would not recommend a person put all their wealth into PMs, better to be diversified.

Everyone needs to make their own personal decisions about investing and it is better not to take anyone's specific advice in my opinion.  But if I personally had to follow some else's advice I would look for people who have made fortunes and seem to be consistently correct in their calls, like Jim Rogers, who used to be in with Soros years ago and from what I have seen and read is correct much of the time.  He is very bullish on commodities in general and bearish on the dollar.

Jim

Jim,

You are right - everyone has to make their own decisions about investing or any of their money decisions.

However, when real estate is in the dumps - real estate is cheap - and one of the best values you can get (assuming you do your homework).

I will say - these people who buy your scrap gold only give you HALF of what it is worth - at best.  And if you sell gold coins to them - they never take into consideration the coin value - only the gold.

I'm watching a program right now about it on tv - they offered 500 dollars for a $3.00 gold coin - worth $5,000.  I do understand that the buyers have to make their profit - but - half?

I have heard Dave Ramsey's course - and read some of his books - I don't agree with him 100% - but, I do understand NOT buying gold (or anything else) until you have all your bills paid and you are DEBT FREE.  Which, is his motto.  Rice and beans and beans and rice, no going out to dinners - nothing - "live like no one else, so that you can live like no one else".

Beth

I think the poster above may be a spambot or something that crawls the web looking for negative posts about Dave Ramsey to reply to.

A poster decided to make his first post the moment I said something bad about Alex Jones as well. Probably a robot or cyborg of some kind. 

Jim,

You are right - everyone has to make their own decisions about investing or any of their money decisions.

However, when real estate is in the dumps - real estate is cheap - and one of the best values you can get (assuming you do your homework).

I will say - these people who buy your scrap gold only give you HALF of what it is worth - at best.  And if you sell gold coins to them - they never take into consideration the coin value - only the gold.

I'm watching a program right now about it on tv - they offered 500 dollars for a $3.00 gold coin - worth $5,000.  I do understand that the buyers have to make their profit - but - half?

I have heard Dave Ramsey's course - and read some of his books - I don't agree with him 100% - but, I do understand NOT buying gold (or anything else) until you have all your bills paid and you are DEBT FREE.  Which, is his motto.  Rice and beans and beans and rice, no going out to dinners - nothing - "live like no one else, so that you can live like no one else".

Beth

For many of us "in the business" these cash for gold places only help people like me get more business. Once one of these places blows someone out of their store ,and I double or even better the offer they received at one, I have gained a loyal customer who passes my name to the next. There are plenty of outlets that pay WAY over half value. You just have to do due diligence and find them. Unfortunately those spending the most on advertising, screaming the loudest, and using 5 people holding signs up on street corners are being seen enough to rip plenty of people off. This week alone ive had a deal where a girl was offered $80 for 25 grams of 18k gold by the local we buy gold folks. I payed $750 for what the cash for gold store offered $80. My payout was 83% of melt leaving me more than enough room to earn a living and keep a young lady from getting robbed. Ive now had 2 of her family in my store since she was in on monday.

     good job       


Beth

this post made me go out and watch Waterworld 

Jim,

You are right - everyone has to make their own decisions about investing or any of their money decisions.

However, when real estate is in the dumps - real estate is cheap - and one of the best values you can get (assuming you do your homework).

I will say - these people who buy your scrap gold only give you HALF of what it is worth - at best.  And if you sell gold coins to them - they never take into consideration the coin value - only the gold.

I'm watching a program right now about it on tv - they offered 500 dollars for a $3.00 gold coin - worth $5,000.  I do understand that the buyers have to make their profit - but - half?

I have heard Dave Ramsey's course - and read some of his books - I don't agree with him 100% - but, I do understand NOT buying gold (or anything else) until you have all your bills paid and you are DEBT FREE.  Which, is his motto.  Rice and beans and beans and rice, no going out to dinners - nothing - "live like no one else, so that you can live like no one else".

Beth

For many of us "in the business" these cash for gold places only help people like me get more business. Once one of these places blows someone out of their store ,and I double or even better the offer they received at one, I have gained a loyal customer who passes my name to the next. There are plenty of outlets that pay WAY over half value. You just have to do due diligence and find them. Unfortunately those spending the most on advertising, screaming the loudest, and using 5 people holding signs up on street corners are being seen enough to rip plenty of people off. This week alone ive had a deal where a girl was offered $80 for 25 grams of 18k gold by the local we buy gold folks. I payed $750 for what the cash for gold store offered $80. My payout was 83% of melt leaving me more than enough room to earn a living and keep a young lady from getting robbed. Ive now had 2 of her family in my store since she was in on monday.

I like how you do business. 

With gold setting records almost daily, you think Dave would change his position, even a bit?

Nooooooo...

He spent the last few minutes of his show backing up his position yet again. And he seemed pretty annoyed, railing on gold buyers as "speculators" rather than "investors." He said gold's track over the last 50 years "sucks."  

With gold setting records almost daily, you think Dave would change his position, even a bit?

Nooooooo...

He spent the last few minutes of his show backing up his position yet again. And he seemed pretty annoyed, railing on gold buyers as "speculators" rather than "investors." He said gold's track over the last 50 years "sucks."  

What about the last 5000 years?  No paper currency has ever held its value like gold over the long haul.

Jim

Hi Immy.  So Dave Ramsey thinks gold's track record for the past 50 years sucks, does he?  I don't know where he's getting his information from but it's crazy.  Like other posters have stated, I warn all of my friends NEVER to buy what I call "paper gold" or, for that matter, "paper silver".  Personally, I don't like anything paper except for books and writing paper and wouldn't give an ounce of my gold for a bucketful of paper stocks.  I'm not sure what the price of an ounce of gold was 50 years ago (1961) but I do know that when I began placer mining for it in 1988, us miners were thrilled when the price went above $400.  So, from about $400 in 1988 to over $1700 an ounce now, it seems to have a pretty great "track record".  By my calculations, that's even a better track record of growth than the price of a gallon of gasoline.     I do know that silver was about $1.00 per ounce 50 years ago and now it's around $40.  Not so bad a track record either, Davie ole boy.
If anyone watched Ron Paul, this weekend in Iowa, you may have heard him say that we needed to return to a precious metal standard for our currency and he went on to say that, according to the Constitution, we never went off of that standard.  While the news media boasted about Bachmann winning the weekend's straw poll there, they hardly mentioned that Ron Paul finished second by less that a percentage point or so. 
~Texas Jay