its where you were born that counts

yes it where you were born that decides what realign you will be  if you had been born in Iran you would be 99% Moslem   if you were born in the USA you are probley Christian   so all you Christian folks your just doing what you have been programmed to do  no thought needed truth is we evolved    mike

Hmm, so the parts that are in Africa that are predominitly Muslim  there should be no christians, right?

[it's what your parents and/or your culture told you when you were growing up.]

Those Christians in Muslim Africa would have been raised in Christian households.


This ultimately is why anyone believes what they do - it's what your parents and/or your culture told you when you were growing up.

If you're born the US south and raised Baptist with the KJV, you will absolutely believe that with no doubt.

Born in northern Pakistan and told the US is Satan and the Quran is truth?  You will believe that so deeply that you might commit suicide if you can kill even one of them.

How about the Orthodox Jew, the devout Buddhist, Shinto Japanese?  Same thing.
What if you had been born in an Aztec culture 1000 years ago, or in the mountains of Nepal, or today in a Kuna tribe on the east coast of Panama?

You would be believing VERY different things, but the one constant is that you would be convinced that your belief is the absolute truth.

Sometimes folks looking for something, will reject a local religion and seek out something that is exotic to them, but that's not common.

The bottom line is a child believes whatever they are told by the people they trust when they are growing up.

But lets not forget the forcible conversion down the ages, from both sides, of whole nations to
the conquerors religion.
We also have the proselytizing efforts of American evangelists spreading their gospel around
the world. This latter seems to be a peculiarly American activity.

Are these converted any LESS a Christian than those born to it ?

[it's what your parents and/or your culture told you when you were growing up.]

This ultimately is why anyone believes what they do - it's what your parents and/or your culture told you when you were growing up.

There's a lot of truth to that, and that is mostly what we see today. But there are also those who are brought out of traditions. To these, truth is what matters...not tradition.

"There's a lot of truth to that, and that is mostly what we see today. But there are also those who are brought out of traditions. To these, truth is what matters...not tradition."                                               so because your mother and father told you it was the truth   you think and believe it is the truth  sure when a big strong rich american goes into a 3'rd world country and says he knows the truth  some follow his lead        but your still doing what you were programed to do by your upbringing   shame on you for screwing up other people's minds  mk

"There's a lot of truth to that, and that is mostly what we see today. But there are also those who are brought out of traditions. To these, truth is what matters...not tradition."                                               so because your mother and father told you it was the truth   you think and believe it is the truth  sure when a big strong rich american goes into a 3'rd world country and says he knows the truth  some follow his lead        but your still doing what you were programed to do by your upbringing   shame on you for screwing up other people's minds  mk

My mother and father didn't tell me this was truth. You've seen so many people caught up in tradition, you can't believe anything else exists. There is something real, or there COULDN'T be a counterfeit. No shame on me.

"There's a lot of truth to that, and that is mostly what we see today. But there are also those who are brought out of traditions. To these, truth is what matters...not tradition."                                               so because your mother and father told you it was the truth   you think and believe it is the truth  sure when a big strong rich american goes into a 3'rd world country and says he knows the truth  some follow his lead        but your still doing what you were programed to do by your upbringing   shame on you for screwing up other people's minds  mk

 Shame on who?  I get what you are sayin'. And I too have been sayin' something similar to this for awhile.  Not so much that everysingle person on the planet is brainwashed from traditions, but that folks need to search out what they believe, not what has been handed down to them. It is an Individual thing, not a religious thing.

Two questions...

1. The instant babies are born, what religion are they?

2. What would Tarzan believe?

Dear knapper;
You wrote:
yes  if you had been born in Iran you would be 99% Moslem
Actually, that's not quite true, my friend. If you were born in Iran, then the chances are fairly good that you would be either a Muslim or a Jew. Yes, my friend, there happens to be a very big Jewish community in Iran, so big in fact, that Iran has the world's second largest Jewish population, with Israel having the most. Therefore, it might behoove one to know all the facts of the matter before jumping to what seems to be obvious conclusions.
Your friend;
LAMAR

Dear knapper;
You wrote:
yes  if you had been born in Iran you would be 99% Moslem
Actually, that's not quite true, my friend. If you were born in Iran, then the chances are fairly good that you would be either a Muslim or a Jew. Yes, my friend, there happens to be a very big Jewish community in Iran, so big in fact, that Iran has the world's second largest Jewish population, with Israel having the most. Therefore, it might behoove one to know all the facts of the matter before jumping to what seems to be obvious conclusions.

Iran has the 26th largest Jewish population. But knapper was still wrong, Iran is only 98% Muslim.

Two questions...

1. The instant babies are born, what religion are they?

2. What would Tarzan believe?

Also, what kind of science do they believe in? Science must not be true.
Are babies skeptics, or non skeptics? Surely you'd want to be the same.

But since you brought it up, can you produce life in a lab? Not manipulate life, but CREATE life. Can you?

Two questions...

1. The instant babies are born, what religion are they?

2. What would Tarzan believe?

Also, what kind of science do they believe in? Science must not be true.
Are babies skeptics, or non skeptics? Surely you'd want to be the same.

But since you brought it up, can you produce life in a lab? Not manipulate life, but CREATE life. Can you?

 

Two questions...

1. The instant babies are born, what religion are they?

2. What would Tarzan believe?

Also, what kind of science do they believe in? Science must not be true.
Are babies skeptics, or non skeptics? Surely you'd want to be the same.

But since you brought it up, can you produce life in a lab? Not manipulate life, but CREATE life. Can you?

 

Simple questions. You asked what religion babies were when they are born. None, obviously. That's your way of saying that no religion is right. So, if you are correct in that, then no science is right either, because no baby is a scientist...has no scientific theories....don't know anything about science at all. Are we all wrong, just because we don't know things when we are born?

Simple questions. You asked what religion babies were when they are born. None, obviously. That's your way of saying that no religion is right.

Well, no, that's not what I was saying. But I do agree with knapper, that for the majority of people religious beliefs are what they learn from family and culture. It's almost hereditary.

I think with instant global communications and more exposure to other cultures this may be getting less true. More people are questioning their religious upbringing and looking at alternatives, maybe choosing a religion that better fits their life views, or maybe rejecting religious beliefs completely. For the folks who choose their religion based on a path of inquiry, I'd say that their religious beliefs are more "right" than someone who simply believes what they were told to believe

So, if you are correct in that, then no science is right either, because no baby is a scientist...has no scientific theories....don't know anything about science at all. Are we all wrong, just because we don't know things when we are born?

When we're born, we don't know religion, or science, or math, or language, or politics. Not much, in fact. Fast-forward 18 years. What language do we speak? Probably what our parents speak. What are our politics? Probably heavily influenced by the politics of our parents. What religion do we believe? Probably what our parents believe. What science did we learn? What math did we learn? Hmmmm.

An 18-year-old American probably has a completely different language, political view, and religion from, say, and 18-year-old Iranian. But, strangely, they probably have learned exactly the same math and science. Why does practically everyone on Earth learn the same math & science, but not the same religion or language or politics? That's an interesting question, at least to me.

- Carl

Why does practically everyone on Earth learn the same math & science, but not the same religion or language or politics? That's an interesting question, at least to me.

- Carl

Because true religion is not learned, it is revealed...demonstrated...lived. Tradition is what is learned, and that is against God's word.
God doesn't have grandchildren.

Actually, there are opposing theories in science.

Because true religion is not learned, it is revealed...demonstrated...lived.

Obviously, your True Religion may be completely different from an Iranian's True Religion. (I'm making a small assumption here.)

Actually, there are opposing theories in science.

Isn't that wonderful?

Because true religion is not learned, it is revealed...demonstrated...lived.

Obviously, your True Religion may be completely different from an Iranian's True Religion. (I'm making a small assumption here.)

Yes, you are. And that is precisely what is wrong with false religion. They have no revelation, but plenty assumptions. Funny, science tends to do that too.

Well let's see if I can turn that idea totally upside down. If you are raised in the US then you are more than likely are going to be a christian.

 The first one is the famous rocker Marilyn Mansion, born and raised under a presbyterian pastor as a father. The second one of course is Ozzy Ozbourne, Once was a devout catholic. Enjoy.....


 

These crackheads are putting on this show to help support their habit.
Just like it pays to be a "Good ol' Boy" in a small town; thats what counts.
And then we have the "Armchair Christians" another select group.

Because true religion is not learned, it is revealed...demonstrated...lived.

The religion that is 'revealed...demonstrated...lived' will always tend to be at least a version of, or your interpretation of, what you have already been exposed to.

If you were born in the US South, for instance, and reject official church doctrine in favor of a personal relationship with your deity, that relationship will still typically be based on the God you were brought up with.

It's highly unlikely that one raised as a Baptist will end up becoming a Nepalese Buddhist, or worshiping Odin, or finding a personal relationship with Greek gods.

There will always be exceptions, like a westerner that becomes a Hindu or even a Taliban and such, but these are rarities. Some reject what they were brought up altogether and may go the opposite route like Ozzy, etc.

In order to be a Christian, for example, you must have had to have HEARD about Christianity in the first place.  Theoretically a God should be able to reveal himself to someone who has never had any exposure to that religion previously, but it doesn't work that way.

I can tell by your post that you really don't know "how it works." Why try to teach something about which you know nothing? I assume you understand the words, "revealed" and "demonstrated." So I'm guessing you just don't believe it.
That's your choice, and choosing is what we're all here for.

Yes, it is rare for an American to become a Buddhist or Muslim, etc. On the other hand it is NOT a rare thing for people the world over to become Christians. That should tell you something. And I'm not talking about those who JUST confess. The world is full of those, but there is some real ones too.

Dear Carl-NC;
You wrote:
Iran has the 26th largest Jewish population. But knapper was still wrong, Iran is only 98% Muslim.

Actually, Iran has many more times than the *official* proclaimed Jews which reside there, my friend. I personally know of a single community in Iran which has a population of over 100,000 Jews and the rest being Christians, however, in order to avoid prosecution they proclaim themselves to be devout followers of Islam.

In other Middle Eastern countries the situation is worse. I know of Christian communities in the Middle East which number close to the millions, yet according to *official* polls and records, they do not exist. By unofficial estimates, Iran is probably close to 90% Muslim, with probably about 30% strict Islamic adherents, which is a very large number. On the other hand, virtually all of the non-Islamic population of Iran are strict adherents to their religions, which is also a very large number. Combine these groups together and you have a powderkeg just waiting for a spark.
Your friend;
LAMAR

I can tell by your post that you really don't know "how it works." Why try to teach something about which you know nothing? I assume you understand the words, "revealed" and "demonstrated." So I'm guessing you just don't believe it.
That's your choice, and choosing is what we're all here for.

Yes, it is rare for an American to become a Buddhist or Muslim, etc. On the other hand it is NOT a rare thing for people the world over to become Christians. That should tell you something. And I'm not talking about those who JUST confess. The world is full of those, but there is some real ones too.

That's because of far greater exposure of Christianity to the world compared to other religions. Christians got around alot.
Spain brought Catholicism to the Phillipines. Europeans/British created colonies in Africa, SE Asia, etc. and the New World, and brought their beliefs with them. Buddhists, not so much.

The English language is also the one you will hear the most around the world. Not as a first language, but if someone in a foreign land is going to know a little (or a lot) of a second language, chances are it will be English for the same reasons.

In order to be a Christian, for example, you must have had to have HEARD about Christianity in the first place.  Theoretically a God should be able to reveal himself to someone who has never had any exposure to that religion previously, but it doesn't work that way.

Ergo my second question, "What would Tarzan believe?"

When Chris Columbus landed in the New World, there was not a single Christian here to greet him. Nor a single Muslim. Nor any Jews. Or Hindus. Or Sikhs. Or Buddhists.....

That's because of far greater exposure of Christianity to the world compared to other religions. Christians got around alot.
Spain brought Catholicism to the Phillipines. Europeans/British created colonies in Africa, SE Asia, etc. and the New World, and brought their beliefs with them. Buddhists, not so much.

The English language is also the one you will hear the most around the world. Not as a first language, but if someone in a foreign land is going to know a little (or a lot) of a second language, chances are it will be English for the same reasons.

English doesn't equal Christian. Catholicism doesn't equal Christian. English is a language and a people, and Catholicism is a denomination which CLAIMS to be Christian.

Again, the problem is you just don't believe. If you did believe you would know what happened to the Apostle Paul on the road to Damascus. God DOES reveal himself DIRECTLY to his Apostles and Prophets. Then the rest of us follow them as they follow Christ (we see Christ in them). Paul said, how can they hear without a preacher, and how can they preach except they be sent. It's the way God has chosen - he reveals himself in human flesh, and THAT is a stumbling block. But he said those who stumble were APPOINTED to stumble.

Well, I would certainly be apt to believe in a god if he revealed himself to me directly.


I'll ask you this. If you yourself had been born and raised without ever hearing about Jesus, Christianity or the Bible, do you think you would believe the same things as you do today?

Well, I would certainly be apt to believe in a god if he revealed himself to me directly.


I'll ask you this. If you yourself had been born and raised without ever hearing about Jesus, Christianity or the Bible, do you think you would believe the same things as you do today?

I was meant to hear it. But yes, even if I had been born in a stable/cave in Bethlehem, I would have heard the truth. Do you get what I mean?

God does reveal himself directly to individuals, just not in the same capacity as he reveals himself to prophets. If He calls you, you'll know it. But if you see him, you'll see him in human flesh, whether or not you recognize him.
This is not denominational teaching. Denominations is the reason so many people don't believe. You've seen only the fake and you equate Christ with all that. Please don't. He has never been, is not, nor will he ever be in denominations.

I was meant to hear it. But yes, even if I had been born in a stable/cave in Bethlehem, I would have heard the truth. Do you get what I mean?

OK, fair enough. You believe from your heart and I will respect that. Thank you for actually answering that question.


A little early, but Merry Christmas,
                                             Jay
                                           

I was meant to hear it. But yes, even if I had been born in a stable/cave in Bethlehem, I would have heard the truth. Do you get what I mean?

OK, fair enough. You believe from your heart and I will respect that. Thank you for actually answering that question.


A little early, but Merry Christmas,
                                             Jay
                                           

Just remember, all that glitters is not gold. But that doesn't mean there is no gold to be had.

Knapper is a Fruit cake 173 post or so, been here since 06. hes a idiot

"Knapper is a Fruit cake 173 post or so, been here since 06. hes a idiot"   watch who you call a idiot if you do not agree with me then thats cool but try to answer the question like you have some brains

Knapper is a Fruit cake 173 post or so, been here since 06. hes a idiot

What has made you say this outburst about Knapper ?
Why do you also hate CappyZ ?
Why do you hate me ?
What is it about us that offends you so much ?

The 3 of yall are internet trolls especially you piggy, Knapper is someone that wil show up every 6 mnths or so then disapper and not reponde to it. Troll like.  You  piggy are just a liar , you new location your trying to say your from is more proof of that you were australia, now Indoneia , but really American.

  I removed the Cappy thread, this am as it was made over a yr ago when cappy was running around like a fool calling folks names and even pming folks calling them names, It was a direct response to a thread he started that was similar.  agien you take things out of context, as well as Knapper.

  I posted this response about Knapper to call him back out  and maybe responde to HIS OWN POST he started a month and a half ago.   Thats called trolling.
  Obviously he still doesent want to participate in the discussion that he started.

Interesting thread.  Can any of y'all explain why you equate the south with the Baptist church?  Well, I guess that one part is called the 'Southern' Baptists.  Well, I guess they get the most publicity, and it's easier to have one group to label and blame.  But seriously, why do you think the entire south is southern Baptist?  The rest of us are happy for them to get the blame for religious extremism, though.

Interesting thread.  Can any of y'all explain why you equate the south with the Baptist church?  Well, I guess that one part is called the 'Southern' Baptists.  Well, I guess they get the most publicity, and it's easier to have one group to label and blame.  But seriously, why do you think the entire south is southern Baptist?  The rest of us are happy for them to get the blame for religious extremism, though.

It's all part of the stereotype.