$hare alleged KGC/Outlaw signs/symbols with/out absolute proof/ none required

Why not share signs/symbols that we think may be KGC/ Outlaw ETC with out arguing about which one they are....or are not?  When we start the negative stuff we all lose!   some one post one and I will also.

I would agree that argueing over who left something behind can be counter-productive but it can also be helpful, just like trying to determine what is and isn't a real treasure marker/sign.

A few more . . .

Alec,

Thanks for sharing your pics. ( I think I thought I may have even saw my own initials on the first one)  You made an excellent point about other's point of view. If we can keep it on a debate level w/o some of the personal attacks we may all come out ahead. I really like your bottom photo. Here is a pic of what my "hoot owl"/"knee tree" was pointing at.

Did you try detecting the spot where it is grown together?

OK, I'll share one.  This is a KGC tree.

alec:
   Is the ancient in your last photo a part of the trail you're following?

The ancient? Are you talking about the bird? If so, yes, this is part of a Spanish trail.

Big Hoss, just one???

And I see you are testing the waters! 

Did you try detecting the spot where it is grown together?

Yes, and at this one also.

Hoss,

Thanks for posting "your" pic.

Hoss,

Thanks for posting "your" pic.

Not sure why "your" is in quotes.  I personally found that tree on my own and took that picture.   

Alec, If I thought there was a slight chance I wouldn't get  raked over the coals, I'd share a lot more.

Take care,
Big Hoss

What? Who would do that??? 

I promise to play nice, really! I'd love to see some of the things you are finding and I won't say a word.

The ancient? Are you talking about the bird? If so, yes, this is part of a Spanish trail.

OK, I've marked up you photo for clarity on my question.  The Ancient is the large profile I outlined and tagged.  There is your shadow bird, but also an eagle's head and a full eagle body.  The tree has 2 goggle eyed birds or whatever you want to call them.  Lastly, the seated figure;  maybe a bear.  
BUT, my original question was about the Ancient man's large profile.  I recognize this photo from a previous posting.

The carving that I've tagged as an eagle's head MIGHT actually be a TURTLE's head...............climbing up from it's nest.  If so, please remember what Old Dog taught us about THAT.

Yea, I have posted this photo before in a couple of places.

This is where our theories on how things were done differ. I don't see all of that other stuff. I think the bird is the only thing that matters and it gives a direction and instruction. In this case the bird is in the valley floor and he is telling you to go up the valley and stay high on the side.

If you do that you come to a peep hole that shows you this. I apologize for it being out of focus but this was taken with my first digital camera and I think it was all of 1mp and didn't have the zoom I needed to focus throught the hole.

alec,
   I have absolutely no reason to doubt you on this.  I'm just presenting some other items to consider.  Maybe this spot is a junction for more than one trail. 
   Out of pure curiosity, what the heck is that material that makes up the turtle's head / eagle's head EYE.  That thing just jumps out at you when you look at that photo.   

The rock formation is a mix of sandstone and limestone. The actual eye that you are referring to appears to be an old tree branch in the crevice behind the "head".

That's a nice photo Hoss and that's a very good lesson about photographing a carving or marker for that matter. I always take several photos from lots of angles, close ups and wide shots. Digital cameras make it easy to do that and not spend a fortune. You just never know when you might need to see something and can't be at the site or when something may disappear or change.

I'll have to take your word on the meaning since it sounds like you already worked it out. I don't deal much with tree carvings in my neck of the woods, mostly rock carvings and carry around type maps.

Autocad, huh? That's a new one on me.

Here's one for ya. Found this one working a line. The flat top boulder was imbedded into the ground and the center of the boulder was dug out. Then they placed a rock in the dug out part and filled in back in with dirt.

Again, we are back to differing opinions, for the most part, I don't think anything that you find marked on a tree or rock is going to be so precise that you need an exact angle or heading but that's just me. I haven't run into anything that precise in the field yet.

I would have interpreted your C differently.

Hoss and Alec,

Thanks for shareing the pics and info. Here's another version of a shaped tree. (This one is replacing an older one that died.)

Always glad to help out. Cool looking tree!

Alec,

That is about the neatest hatchet I have seen. Did you go in the direction the handle is pointing or did something tell you to go elsewhere? I have found a few hatchet heads also but w/o handles.

The hatchet is all one piece and made of metal. I didn't follow it anywhere because it wasn't old enough for what I was looking for.

Again, we are back to differing opinions, for the most part, I don't think anything that you find marked on a tree or rock is going to be so precise that you need an exact angle or heading but that's just me. I haven't run into anything that precise in the field yet.

I would have interpreted your C differently.

Alec how would you have interpreted Hoss's C? As usual I tried to post some pics and it said my file was too big....I want to get in on the fun!...Steve

Steve, I would be guessing because I am looking at it without any context. The flat side of the C could be telling you to take a line but the first thing I would look for is a flat space like a bluff face or large (really large) boulder with a flat side. It could even be something that a creek or maybe a wash/gully runs into and changes direction along the flat surface like a knoll or small hill. The dot to me indicates something at that spot.

Maybe Big Hoss will share what's on the other side of the tree, this could change how the "C" is used or interpreted.

Big Hoss, I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just telling how I would interpret the C based on what I have seen and only because I was asked. 

Alec,

Well I guess your hatchet being made of metal would explain the precise lines. Personally I would of followed the way the handle was pointing(if the item could be dated as at least 80 or so years old....?) to see if anything else could be located. I have more time than money/sense anyway.

Yea, many years ago I would have done the same thing. I learned the hard way that I should ignore things for a later time and stay on what ever trail I am working on and not get side tracked. Things go faster that way!

No worries Big Hoss, you are there and I'm not. I was just saying how I would look at it based on the limited amount of info I had. I wouldn't want you to give up any information you're not comfortable parting with.

This is something a lot of people don't understand about interpreting signs/symbols. They can mean something very different at each site depending on the terrain at the sites.

This is something a lot of people don't understand about interpreting signs/symbols. They can mean something very different at each site depending on the terrain at the sites.

Exactly!  People put pictures up on the forum and ask "what does this mean"?  You can't know what most stuff means without having a lot of information that probably shouldn't be divulged.  Other information that must be known, most people don't even know to get.
Big Hoss 

Wow, it's dark and cloudy with lightning here right now, is that because we are agreeing? Is the world coming to an end?? 

That was probably done by Indians a long,long time ago to tell others about good game in the area.

what was??

Stevesno,

The only way I know to downsize photos is to "right-click" on the photo in question. You should get a "save as" option. You can enter a word or phrase to help you find it in your pictures or where ever you put it. There should be a re-size option and you need to click on "smaller." You should be able to post the smaller size....some one else could probably explain this better as I am new to this myself. Hope you are able to get some of your pics on here for us to see. Thanks and good luck.

Alec,

Guess I will go ahead and jump out there at the risk of looking stupid. In the "sawed into tree",(post # 30), did you find metal in there? lead you somewhere else?...or just another metal hatchet/

Shortstack,

I can see most of what you marked. I would just add the wings to Alec's shadow bird head...does not change the meaning as presented by Alec, just confirms travel in that direction to me.

Stevesno,

The only way I know to downsize photos is to "right-click" on the photo in question. You should get a "save as" option. You can enter a word or phrase to help you find it in your pictures or where ever you put it. There should be a re-size option and you need to click on "smaller." You should be able to post the smaller size....some one else could probably explain this better as I am new to this myself. Hope you are able to get some of your pics on here for us to see. Thanks and good luck.

oddrock...Thanks for the advice, I tried that and it didnt say that my pic was too big but it was my file....I've really got to learn this..lol

Alec thank you for your interpretation of the C....Thanks all for sharing their opinions and pics...Steve

Oddrock,

Thanks for pointing out the wings, I should have done that but I've looked at that photo so many times I just assumed it was obvious. The wing outstretched indicates the bird is flying and he is looking up so I chose to go up the valley and along the high side which brought me to the next clue.

If you look closely in the photo with the cut tree you will see the handle of a knife. A hole had been bored into the side of the tree and the knife placed inside then the tree grew back closed over the knife. The knife was used with another piece of information in the map to give an important point in the map. In this case, the map had a compass heading in it and it showed that you needed to find a "corner" and the corner came after a specific clue. The "corner" ended up being this knife pointing at a 90 degree angle from the compass heading making an imaginary corner or angle. It took me several months to figure that one out but after I did, working the map went quickly again.

Here's a photo of the spot in the tree that had grown back closed and the knife once it was out of the tree. Again, these were with an old crappy digital camera so they aren't the greatest of photos.

Alec,

Thanks for sharing the info on the knife in the tree. I have not found that set up yet. Most of my trees are associated with rock(s).

A closer pic of the rocks by the tree growing at an angle.

This particular layout was the same way. The first part of the map required you to find a triangle and the triangle was made of three trees with an upright rock at the base of each tree.

I wouldn't hold your breath on that one Hoss! 

Why are you always in the KGC forum then???   

Because I think there is two sides to the story and the true believers will never mention anything that doesn't fit their theories. In my opinion, this is unfair to anyone new to treasure hunting that might be interested in the alleged KGC treasures. Remember, I fell into this trap myself. At the time when I beleived the KGC hid mega buck depositories there wasn't anybody argueing the other side. This was good for me in that it forced me to do my own research once it became obvious something was wrong with the theory.

By giving my opinion based on my own research and work in the field, it gives someone else reading the forum more information than they had. They don't have to believe what I say but they can take boths sides of the argument and then research what they want. When I started treasure hunting Al Gore hadn't invented the internet yet. I'm just helping out!  

Hoss,

Thanks for your last post and pics. While we have not found the metal inside of the trees that I have posted so far, the trees and rocks do point to buried metal objects. ( smaller ones only 4-6" deep, larger ones around 18"  some 33' apart, some 66' apart and some a lot farther... seems to be precise angles) better surveying equipment is in the future. 

Yes Oddrock, some hootowls do point directly at markers.
Good luck,
Big Hoss

Alec,

I appreciate everything you have showed us and hope you continue. I have been on trails that I thought were Spanish/Jesuit etc. and something would show up to make me think KGC./Masonic or from that time period. If I only have Spanish/J s/s on a trail then that is what I consider that layout to be until shown otherwise .(by signs/symbols)

Oddrock, I won't be debating any who, hows or whys on this particular string because you requested that we not and that you were just interested in markers and signs.

I will say that I agree with a lot of your last post. There were other people here, long before Columbus, and some of those people were looking for things of value. It's only human nature that other "groups" that came along might try to find what anyone before them had found or hid.

I also agree with following trails. I work a trail as a specific type, outlaw, Spanish, (even KGC Hoss), until I find something that says otherwise. To me, it's all about interpreting the clues and getting to the end.

Thanks for sharing all the pic's and sides of the beliefs. Don't have any pic's to share yet, but have a
piece of property I will be investigating in the near future and will share what I find. Looks to have promise.

Spanish bird

Alec,

Nice bird. Here is another.

Wldbil,

Welcome in...look forward to seeing your pics in the future.

Thanks oddrock!

Thanks to everyone who has shared their pictures, and ideas on their meanings. I haven't seen anything close to these, however, I do enjoy reading about them.

bsloan,

Welcome aboard...keep your eyes open... some things are on public land/city parks etc.

Big Hoss,

Sorry you have left us or been on vacation? The 338 degrees you mentioned is what we have on one trail! Not sure if you thought I was choseing sides or what...will not bother you anymore as you did not respond to my private message.

oddrock  Picture 053 seems to me to be a face looking up. I've seen one like it and found it meant to look all around as there are one or more things you need to see. Jim

I was kind of looking forward to seeing some more of Big Hoss' photos myself.

Big Hoss,

Sorry you have left us or been on vacation? The 338 degrees you mentioned is what we have on one trail! Not sure if you thought I was choseing sides or what...will not bother you anymore as you did not respond to my private message.

Hmmmm...I wrote you a long response to your PM.  Not sure why you didn't get it.   

alec:
   Did the Spanish bird monument in #52 lead you to your avatar?

Did anyone ever notice the sides of a KFC fountain drink cup also says "KGC"!!   

oddrock  Picture 053 seems to me to be a face looking up. I've seen one like it and found it meant to look all around as there are one or more things you need to see. Jim

Jim,

Thanks for the input. This one changes as you walk around it. The photo posted, to me has a man's face in the upper center. Three steps in either direction and it changes to an eagle or vulture head...there is more to see from this spot so your line of thinking does seem to fit.

After studying the pic for awhile it came to me as viewed by you...had to open my old mind and quit focasing on what I was used to seeing. I have turned it on it's side and marked. Is this what you were seeing?

alec:
   Did the Spanish bird monument in #52 lead you to your avatar?

That bird did not lead to the heart rock on the avatar. They are several miles apart and not connected. The heart in my avatar takes you to a cave where there are/were some spanish carvings.

KFC, KGC I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed that! Maybe the group has invested some of it's mega millions in a couple of franchises!  

oddrock  Now that youve turned it on its side look at the left side. I see the full face profile and eye. Sorry-spent a while trying to get an example posted . Will try to sort out my problem and get back.

oddrock  Now that youve turned it on its side look at the left side. I see the full face profile and eye. Sorry-spent a while trying to get an example posted . Will try to sort out my problem and get back.

TJim,
The face profile does stand out.

A note to everybody....I realize  I am mixing s/s that may be a lot older than KGC/outlaw....but then they are sometimes mixed on a trail.
Here is another example of a tree marker.

Finally got this example to load. This is spanish or mexican. Means to look all around for further information.

Tjim

That is a great lookin head. Great features, thanks for posting. Here is one of mine... Oddrock.

Any one been on a trail they believed to be KGC and uncovered a water well bucket or a washtub with the bottom portion smoothly cut off? (handles intact and the item otherwise in good shape)

I've know of an outlaw site where a bucket was found with a hole deliberately cut into the bottom of a bucket, actually two.

I've know of an outlaw site where a bucket was found with a hole deliberately cut into the bottom of a bucket, actually two.

Alec,

Can you narrow it down a little for us slow learners..... two holes in one bucket? one hole in two buckets, or two trails with one....?? What is your interpretation?

Two different buckets on two different trails. One bucket appeared to have the hole cut it in so it would not hold water, the bucket was buried without a lid.

The second bucket had a lid on it and a hole in the bottom and in this case something was found a little deeper under the bucket (about a foot). It was assumed the hole in the bucket was to indicate you should "look through" the bucket and deeper in the ground. It could be that this hole was also to let moisture drain but there is no way to know for sure. It's just a given to check holes after I have pulled something from the ground but back then they wouldn't have been running a detector.

I have heard the interpretation of "looking through" the bucket from a few other hunters also so this may be a good interpretation.

I feel the need to warn all members of one method that is being used to determine the exact locations of your potential treasure sites and photographs.  This is one reason why, after a very expensive lesson learned last winter, that I no longer post digital photographs of any of my treasure signs here or anywhere else online.  It is called geotagging or GPS photograph tracking.  Thieves can take any copy of a digital photograph, which was taken by a camera containing this GPS device, and find out the precise coordinates of where the photograph was taken.  In other words, they can take this information and drive directly to the tree, rock, or anywhere else this digital photograph was taken.  Thieves and hackers can even hack into your computer and remove your photographs and, from them, can determine this valuable information.  Here are a couple of sites which explain this process:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Positioning_System

http://www.ppgis.net/photo_gps.htm 

Do you still wonder why so many people are engaged in "fishing" for information and photographs?   

~Texas Jay 

The big thing here is that the camera you are using has to have the GPS tagging device. Most cameras do not have this as a standard feature although you can by a GPS tagger for a lot of the mid to high end DSLR's.

99% of cameras don't have this feature so relax, enjoy life a little! Not everyting is a conspiracy.

Alec, if 99% of the cameras do not have this device, then the hackers only need to find the 1% that do to hit the jackpot. Don't worry, I am enjoying life a lot.   
~Texas Jay

Well sure they can, provided they can find the map that goes with the clues, can interpret the clues properly to take them to the cache location, get lucky enough that the cache is still there and hasn't already been recovered and recover the cache without getting into trouble.

Sounds simple enough. I don't think there are too many treasure hunters out there using a GPS tagging system on their cameras. I don't know of too many that will lug a full size DSLR capable of accepting a GPS tagging device to a treasure site.

Well, members are of course free to either heed or not heed this warning.  At the very least, it should educate other members about something to consider when purchasing their next digital cameras and what to look for in the cameras they are currently using.  I'm kind of surprised that it has not been mentioned here before now.
~Texas Jay

I would agree that it is a good thing to keep in mind. I just know from experience that you have to want the GPS tagging for it to even occur and I only know of professional and some semi professional photographers that use the GPS tagging.

OK

Anyone have any "safe signs/symbols" to share or do we want to quit the thread?

Oddrock

It doesn't look like too many people want to share.

It doesn't look like too many people want to share.

Well Alec,

I can certainly live with that. I will post this one (items found near  hoot owl trees ...not in an old dump) then we can piss on the fire and call the dogs.

OK

Anyone have any "safe signs/symbols" to share or do we want to quit the thread?

Oddrock

I am not sure what you mean by safe signs/symbols...Do you mean a container that represents a cache?...Steve

OK

Anyone have any "safe signs/symbols" to share or do we want to quit the thread?

Oddrock

I am not sure what you mean by safe signs/symbols...Do you mean a container that represents a cache?...Steve

Stevesno,

I meant pics with out GPS incuded as pointed out by TexasJay a little ways back in this thread.

I am interested in any rock carvings , petroglyps, etc...found in Oklahoma. I have been researching the meanings to signs and symbols found in this manner. Please email me any pics and gps or general local area of where image was taken. If you feel that coordinates would be giving away to much I would still like to get any images of rock carvings from Oklahoma. I am compiling these in to a rock carving topographical map of the Oklahoma area. Also interested in anything you may think is related to the James Younger gang or KGC. Please email images to tomccue@yahoo.com.

Thanks
Tom McCue

Just want to let everyone know I have seen the images posted all over the internet and on the forums. I am looking for images from people who have these in their private collections.

Hi all I am looking for any pics or images of rock carvings or petroglyphs in Oklahoma as well as the general location or GPS coordinates of these. If you do not feel comfortable giving out the locations that is fine I would still like to have the images. I am currently working on a project regarding Jesse James and the KGC and would like to add these images to a topographical map and research references so the locations would be helpful in that regard.

Thanks
Tom McCue

Alec, thanks for the peep hole shot.  I love those things!  (Never seen one personally.)

You're welcome! I have run across these peep hole type windows several times.
This one is Spanish and not outlaw but I thought I would post it anyway.

You're welcome! I have run across these peep hole type windows several times.
This one is Spanish and not outlaw but I thought I would post it anyway.

Peephole sounds kinky.  Key hole!

Thought I would post this in honor of the up coming deer seasons. Happy Hunting All.

Oddrock

A couple of pics
Knife pic shows knife ONLY. I lined up with North and it is 60degrees off North, that is why you see "6"

It doesn't look like too many people want to share.

Well Alec,

I can certainly live with that. I will post this one (items found near  hoot owl trees ...not in an old dump) then we can piss on the fire and call the dogs.

Oddrock, a metal detector user recently found an old bucket nearly identical to the one shown on the right side of your photo at one of our most promising KGC depository sites in central Texas.  The one he found was crushed flat. 
Texas Jay
http://knightsofthegoldencircle.webs.com

Wouldn't a crushed bucket just be a piece of trash?

Wouldn't a crushed bucket just be a piece of trash?

Yes, unless it was put there by the KGC in which case it is no longer a piece of trash.

Well, you know me Hoss, I doubt the KGC left it behind unless it was trash.   

But, for the sake of a discussion, wouldn't the crushed bucket have to have something etched on it or be shaped into a specific shape or be shown on a map to actually mean something? And, logically, I think it would be safe to assume that a buried bucket that was still completely in tact hadn't been buried long enough for the KGC to have put it in the ground. 

There are a lot of variables here that will make a big difference but erring on the cautious side, it would be logical to assume the crushed bucket is just a crushed bucket until something tells you otherwise. Based on Texas Jay's posts in the past I don't think his track record is good enough for everyone to assume "WOW, a crushed bucket, he must be on to something."

Well, you know me Hoss, I doubt the KGC left it behind unless it was trash.   

But, for the sake of a discussion, wouldn't the crushed bucket have to have something etched on it or be shaped into a specific shape or be shown on a map to actually mean something? And, logically, I think it would be safe to assume that a buried bucket that was still completely in tact hadn't been buried long enough for the KGC to have put it in the ground. 

Obviously we can't say whether the bucket is a KGC marker or not because we don't know the situation or circumstances.  But I will say that I have found things that you would probably tend to think weren't KGC clues that I know are.  Several are depicted in the carvings.  Some are not altered and some have been bent, cut, ground, or notched.  I have many, many markers that have no directions being pointed or etchings on them.  They do give you a bearing but I'm afraid I don't want to tell how that is being indicated.  What I have found is that markers tend to be fine when I locate them.  It's when they are removed from the ground that they begin to deteriorate.  I don't remove markers, I leave them in place.
Good luck,
Hoss

Well i thought the fire was out.  hmmmm if anyone cares.. the junk pic...if u look close u might see... a  mason jar with a can in it. If u look closer..maybe a bullet hole that busted the jar..  and left a hole in the can. The front of the jar might say...self-sealing Wide-Mouth Mason...the bottom if u could see it mite say...Sand Springs, Okla....
Just coincedinces

Oddrock

Hi Oddrock.  All of those details are very interesting.  The one that caught my attention the most is your mention of Sand Springs, Oklahoma.  Over 30 years ago, in Brownwood, I was metal detecting a lot underneath where a very old house had just recently been torn down.  I found an old saloon token marked "Sand Springs, Oklahoma" on that lot.  It may or may not mean anything but this lot was only one block from where Brownwood's Henry Ford had his first home in town and even closer to where an old school had been which carried his name - Ford School.  It was in this school, where the KGC held some of their meetings.  It's something interesting to think about anyway.  I wish I still had that old token but that was in my wilder days and I think I sold it. 
~Texas Jay 

Jay,

Some say Frank James spent some of his later days around Sand Springs, Okla.....Just something I read somewhere, no actual proof.

Oddrock

Here is what I found about treasure allegedly hidden by the James Gang southeast of Sand Springs and another account of treasure of Cole Younger's downstream from the Sand Springs Bridge.  Scroll down on this page to "State of Oklahoma" for these two accounts.

http://knightsofthegoldencircle-kgc.com/JessesHideout.htm 

~Texas Jay
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bloodybillandersonmystery  - our group has documented several visits to Brownwood and Brown County by Frank James, Jesse James, and Cole Younger.

I'm not sure I would be quoting "Randy Jesse James Sumpter" but the other treasures listed (well some of them anyway) have come from sources than Floyd Mann. He seems to throw everything connected to Jesse and Frank into the KGC myths which, in my opinion, is wrong, especially when he brings up the black book.

Some of the treasures listed may actually exist but I don't think they have anything to do with the KGC.

Goverton, those pictures must have been taken a number of years ago.

Here is a pic of a rock that I posted a thread on in the "What Is It?" Forum.  I don't claim to know for sure but upon researching the area I found that Rober Dalton of the famed Dalton Gang had robbed a train in Adair, Oklahoma about 30 miles east of where the rock was found with other names and lettering on an undercut shelf in a creek bed overlooking the Arkansas River just west of Tulsa.  It was "near" what is known to be "Lost City" which is where noted KGC Outlaw Jesse James and his Gang of Outlaws had a hideout. In fact, the State bulldozed over one Jesse James Hideout that previously was a marked Historical Marker and local tourist attraction in favor of a four lane hiway and bridge spanning the Arkansas River into Sand Springs, Oklahoma.  The Daltons were rumoured to have a hideout approximately 2 miles southeast of downtown Sand Springs, up a creek on the south side of the River. I read this in archival data for the State of Oklahoma.  I have searched for 10 years while living in the area and dont doubt the search attempts of the many locals in that area so I truly doubt the presence of any treasure left in the area but I might suspect that this particular rock may have been used by someone to mark the location or general diretion to the location of hidden treasure long ago.




What I do kow is that the lettering and symbol were both carved long ago by the condition of the rock and its location corresponds to historical data of the area being a favored hideout location to two prominent Outlaw Gangs, one being a reported member of the KGC, Jesse James.  I now live in Virginia but hope to return to the area someday soon.  Als I recently purchased an original first edition print of "When the Daltons Rode" printed in 1937 and written by Emmit Dalton, Robert Daltons brother and the only surviving member of the gang after the botched Coffeeville, Kansas Bank robbery in 1892.  I look forward to recieving this book and reading it in its entirety as it has a whole chapter on the Adair Train Robbery and hopefully will shed some light on the ensuing aftermath of that event.  I will report on this soon.  Enjoy!













Sean

Your first Rock pic Looks Like a "R" but could represent the area of your other pics( ledge) if you take off the left straight line off the R.   The other sign on 1st rock at first appears to be the Pie sign. But it may be telling you "Fence Post".
Go to http://www.glorecords.blm.gov/search/default.aspx#searchTabIndex=1

If you know the Township and Range of that area, you can search for Plat map that  may show farm land with fencing around it near this ledge.  Could be a Corner Post.